Monday, January 31, 2011

Is it wrong to only date black (or white) women?


Happy Monday, y'all! Dr. Jayme and I have been (in all our spare time) conducting some feedback sessions with people that write in with questions to BougieLand. Not counseling just discussions where we figure out where their head was when they sent in the question. Today's three gents chatted with us for about an hour before things got heated. I decided to bring the discussion to BnB. I already know some people are going to act a pure "D" fool over this topic. But let's get the stories. 

Case 1) Wil, our resident resident in Phoenix has been besieged on his Facebook page by friendship requests from ladies of the Caucasian persuasion. Though Dr. Martin is biracial, he has a strong preference for the Nubian Queens. A particularly persistent girl asked him why he wouldn't return her emails and he said he was really only interested in dating black women. She called him a racist. 

Case 2) Jake, our resident sister-loving white guy in Tampa catches wreck on the regular from friends, family and people who don't know him. He has only dated black girls since the age of 14. (He's 29 now) He actually gets irritated when he is asked why he dates black women. His response is always the same "I just like what I like."

Case 3) Gerald K, a professional brother 32 years of age living in Atlanta who has stated emphatically (on this blog even) that sisters are simply "not worth the trouble" and only dates white women. Not Asian or Latina or any other flavor. He calls it "a lifestyle preference." But did say that if there was a sister who acted "less black" he would give her a shot.

I'll admit that on a personal level (I am a Black woman after all), Gerald irritated me. He argued that it wasn't a knock against black women, he just chooses not to "be bothered" with us anymore. He wanted to know what the difference was between him, Wil and Jake. [This is when the conversation got heated.] 

I may or may not have told Gerald that he wasn't going to be missed by any of the sisters. Gerald said Jake only dated black women because they were "low-hanging fruit." Jake may have called him an unrepeatable name. Jayme had to tell all of us to play nice. Wil said his issue with Gerald was that he assumed that all Black women were the same due to packaging (skin color). Wil said he simply preferred to have a cultural commonality with a woman he was in a relationship with. Jake, on the other hand, had grown up around black girls and that's really all he ever knew and felt comfortable with until college. And by then, (as he said) he was hooked.

But when Jayme asked them to describe the characteristics of their perfect woman (without race and appearance) and then asked them what would happen if they found that perfect woman in a different flavored (or sized) package, the whole conversation was stymied. This had not occurred to them.

So is it racist to only consider one particular race in your dating pool? What's the difference between a preference and prejudice? Who's right? Who's wrong? Who's rolling with Wil, Jake or Gerald? And what would you do if your perfect mate came in an unexpected package? Play nice in the comments, the floor is yours...

202 comments:

1 – 200 of 202   Newer›   Newest»
Rocheejeffrey said...

Ok, let me just say that I have no problem with anyone's preference as long as they don't choose to denigrate people of the race that is not their preference.That being said, Gerald can kick rock with flip flops. Anyone who says that black women are "low hanging fruit" or whatever the heck he said, is an idiot. He is a product of black women. His ancestors were black women. If he has a daughter, guess what, she will be considered a black woman. Be serious sir. If black women are "low hanging fruit", what the heck are black men? I need black men who think they are God's gift to this earth to go read some statistics and watch the news. Be serious sir. Sorry, I had to go there.

Again, I have no problem with preferences because ultimately people may feel more comfortable with people of a certain race or more physically attracted to members of a certain race. I know that I prefer dark skin and I can't imagine being in a serious relationship with someone who wasn't black. Am I open to the possibility? Sure. Would I degrade another race of people to justify my preference, ABSOLUTELY NOT.

NoNotPinkett said...

I would've hit all of these points, so I agree completely. Thanks for this.

Michele said...

I don't believe it's racist to consider only one race in your dating pool. People like who they like. I'm not offended by Gerald's views. He's ignorant and can't help himself. How does one act "less Black" for goodness sake? I do not have a race preference and have dated both Black, White and Hispanic men. Core values don't really have a color, do they?

Ms. Jay said...

I have no problem with people having a preference. Everyone has a preference and what they desire their mate to look like. I think the problem comes in when you feel you have to insult other races or because you want your kids to have "pretty hair , pretty eyes and light skin". I heard one guy say that he only dates Asians because they are subservient, and wont fight back. Um ok , thats one of the dumbest reasons I have heard for falling in love with someone.

Gerald's mentality irritates me. I will refrain from saying what I really want to say , but um sir check yourself please. Check your motivation is all I'm gonna say for now to him.

Jubilance1922 said...

Based on the descriptions you gave, sounds like Wil & Jake have a preference while Gerald has a prejudice.

There's a big difference btwn thinking a certain trait is attractive, and outright avoiding everyone with a specific trait due to past negative experiences. That's where the prejudice comes in - without even taking into account character, personality, etc Gerald has completely written off every Black woman. Just from what's written, it doesn't appear that Wil & Jake have done that, they just simply are attracted to what they like.

Gerald needs some help.

tiffanyinhouston said...

Like the other commenters, I'm laser focused on Gerald. And I guess my question to him would be why?

Why do you care what black women think since we are low hanging fruit?
Why did you write/contact this blogger who discusses relationships from a black woman's perspective?
Why did you even agree to participate in a discussion with Dr. Jayme/Chele?

I ask this in all sincerity cause I really don't understand. I'm confuzzled as hell. You've obviously washed your hands of us (and every other minority group of women apparently), so why not go about your merry way and live your life.

blackprofessor said...

We of African descent have to realize that our "preferences" are rooted in centuries of Eurocentric conditioning. There is a reason why we (collectively speaking) prefer light-skin, white skin, long hair that is straight and/or wavy when those aren't looks that are native to our ancestors. Our prefernces definitely have an element of conditioning to them and I think that Black people need to be honest about that. Notwithstanding, I don't think there is anything wrong with having preferences as long as we remain open to other possibilities.

I would encourage all the men to be open and flexible as you never know who your soul mate could be. Usually, they come in a package that we don't expect and I think it is the universe's way of assessing if we are willing to look beyond the surface or not.

If my soul mate came in an unexpected package, I would take the bow off and enjoy!

Iamanmd said...

many good insights here.. i would have to say that Preference should never lead to you PREJUDICE against other races.. YOU LIKE WHO YOU LIKE.. not a problem..hell, women love a tall man, that doesnt mean they are PREJUDICED against short men, they just PREFER and are more attracted to TALL MEN.
My specific take on this, is that one should never limit their options when it comes to dating. You should be open to all kinds of SANE, CLEAN, MATURE, Self Centered, Non CODEPENDENT, NON CONTROLLING, and not needy, adults as possible :)

JN

Penny said...

"Act less black"-is that the romantic equivalent to the ridiculous mindset that people that speak grammatically correct English are "acting white?" Both sentiments are examples of ignorance. I wonder what happened to Gerald for him to arrive at that mindset?

I hope you did tell Gerald that he will not be missed by black women. The last thing Black women (or any woman of any race, color, ethnic background, etc.) needs is a man who feels he has done her a favor by overlooking what he views as deficit. That said, he is free to date whom he wants, and if does not view Black women as an acceptable partner, he certainly should not be dating them.

I am a Black woman, and my preference would be to have a Black man. That said, I recognize that people have the freedom to make their own choices for what they like, and their choice for what they find attractive and/or appealing at the expense of does not necessarily make them racist. If my mate came in an unexpected package, yay for me!!

MelaninEnriched said...

Ok, this is a great topic! I'm on Team Wil and Team Jake. The reason I am is because both of them were honest. Wil says he prefers Black women and wants someone whom he shares some commonalities with, while Jake said that he likes what he likes. Now, Gerald, on the other hand, proceeded to say why he DIDN'T like BW. That is what ALWAYS gets the ones who are doing it for the wrong reasons, IMO. Instead of stating why he preferred WW, he stated why he DIDNT date BW. I have a problem with that. I don't care that he prefers WW, I have a problem with the fact that he feels it necessary to denigrate BW in the process. I've dated interracially as well and sometimes I'll ask the guy, especially if he's White and has stated that he doesn't date WW, why, and the answer is generally about why he prefers BW. I personally have NEVER met a WW who said because WW are XYZ (insert all the negatives). It's usually just because they prefer BW, while NOT disrespecting WW. It's funny because sometimes they'll usually add that they have nothing against WW, it's just that they're more attracted to BW for whatever reason. Now whether that is true or not, who who am I to question that man's motives, but the fact that he didn't want to disrespect his own culture/color says a lot.

Just_A_Thought1218 said...

So is it racist to only consider one particular race in your dating pool? What's the difference between a preference and prejudice? Who's right? Who's wrong? Who's rolling with Wil, Jake or Gerald? And what would you do if your perfect mate came in an unexpected package? Play nice in the comments, the floor is yours...

If you only consider one particular race because of stereotypes - positive or negative - then something in your milk ain't clean and you need to promptly examine your bias and internalized bigotry. Yes, there are cultural similarities or likehoods with certain groups, and it may seem like you are just choosing people based on that, but you have to be grown up enough to realize when you've crossed the line from preference to prejudice. MOreover, you also have to realize when your preferences are influenced by prejudices. WE live in a white supremacist society that bombards everyone 24/7 with messages of what is good, desirable, attractive, etc. You have to be willing to face just how much of that programming you have absorbed and how much work you are going to do to decolonize your mind.

Personally, I love men that love black women. It's nice to be validated and valued, as long as I'm not being fetishized. Gerald is entitled to his opinion and his dating strategy, so no matter how ignorant it appears to me, it's his life and his loss. As for me, I have no problem wih my mate coming in an unexpected package because I'm at the point where character and personality count more than strictly physical appearance. That, and the phenotype I prefer is shared by multiple ethnicities, so it wouldn't be hard for me to be drawn to someone outside of my ethnic group.

MidWestDominicana said...

Dag, Chele...no easing into the week, I see!!
I agree with most of what has already been said here. I could go into a long diatribe about how I view ethnicity and what we call "race" (I sincerely believe, in respect to humans, there is only ONE "race" and one genus (homosapien))" but I will respect the bougie rules and keep my comments as short as I can.

It is apparent to me that Gerald has given up and he is projecting his own shortcomings and/or hurts and negative experiences onto women of color. That said, he should not be dating ANYONE, because most likely, he will end up with a woman that herself harbors bigoted and or prejudiced views. They'll only feed each other and create a very disharmonious lifestyle. What will Gerald do if he happens to marry a White woman and has daughters who look more like him than her? Are they less deserving of his love? Will he walk out on them because they happen to be brown and beautiful? Is he not willing to "be bothered" with them because they look like the type of women he wishes to have no dealings with? I'm sure he hasn't even thought of these questions.

I think that Gerald should seriously seek personal counseling to get to the bottom of his "preferences", as what he has stated seems to be a bandaid over a very large gaping wound.

Additional, as a very proud Black/Latina woman, I think cross-ethnic dating is a BEAUTIFUL thing. I love it and I encourage it when it is done for the right reasons with the right end in mind. My future sister in law is White and is one of the realest most wonderful people I have ever had the pleasure of meeting. A large portion of my biological family is White and I love them all.

My preference is to follow Dr. King's suggestion of "content of character" versus "color of skin". None of us can control the color of our skin, short of chemical augmentation. Let's just love who we love.

Jasmin said...

He's looking for the "No, Ideal Black Man (TM), please don't go!" treatment, and when it doesn't happen he'll go back to bitching about how sisters weren't worth the trouble in the first place.

ASmith said...

Goodness gracious.

I've probably said this before: IMO, it's ok to like what you like and to pursue what you like. It is not ok to like what you like at the extreme exclusion of anything else. But honestly, the only reason it's not ok is because it might hurt you. In the grand scheme, you ain't doing me no favors or a disservice. Doesn't mean I don't smart at the comments, though.

Truth is, I think black women are ok with Jake and not ok with Gerald because Gerald (can I call him Gerry? You know what, nevermind) has a preference that feels like an attack on us. It feels like an attack because it seems every time we turn around, black women are being lampooned on a comedy sketch show, berated in a comedian's act, belittled in a 2-time divorcee's book on how to get a man (coughSteveHarveycough) or otherwise told we just ain't cuttin' it. Meanwhile, the FLOTUS is black, the CEO of Xerox is a black woman, Oprah is a black woman... I mean who else we gotta send up out here to get some legitimate and positive shine? Heck, can we at least get a black woman on SNL?? I think collectively we've just taken so much... well... abuse, that any slight feels about 1000 times worse than it really is.

Gerald can have his preference and I can try to let him do that while resisting the urge to call it bullshiggity -- mostly because I would never call Jake's preference the same and honestly, the 2 are doing the same thing, just to two different groups of women. Having said that, I do see one stark difference in how Jake's preference and Gerald's preference is presented -- and I seem to see this a lot when you compare a white man who prefers black women to a black man who prefers non-black women: the white guy has a preference for while the black guy has a preference against. In other words, Jake wants black women and Gerald just doesn't want black women (though I see the clarification that he doesn't want any minority woman). Too often black men act like, and are then portrayed, as just not wanting a black woman and I think THAT is what we take issue with. Prefer your white women, but can you just not act like black women are leprosy?

MelaninEnriched said...

^^^^THIS. You broke it down with the preference for and against. ITA with this entire post!

happinessisme said...

It's wrong if you make sweeping generalizations about people based on racial stereotypes. Gerald is no better than the black women or women of color that he speaks so lowly of. He's part of the problem. I could easily say all black men are lazy, incompetent and are only good for slanging the D. But that wouldn't be true now would it? I haven't met all black men and I know quite a few who don't fit that mold. katt williams was right. If your over 25 and still talking bout dudes or sisters ain't ish, it's because that's what your attracting.

Bethany Showell said...

You said this better than I ever could.

Bethany Showell said...

So ditto to pretty much everything everybody else said. Team Wil and Team Jake over here. Everyone has a preference - they expressed it respectively. Gerald crossed the line to prejudice w/the poo on the bottom of my shoe attitude. I'm Skittles (taste the rainbow) when it comes to dating so the package doesn't matter at all to me.

taut_7 said...

i think it is very racist to single out one race and say i'm only dating them, even if "they" are your own race. yes you can have a preference but to eliminate a potential partner, someone who might be great for you solely based on skin color is just terrible. no other word for it. sure i've only dated black or ethnic (by ethnic i mean african or caribbean) women my life but that doens't mean i would be opposed to dating outside my race if the opportunity presented itself.

GrownAzzMan said...

Well, I only date black women so I can understand having a preference. However, if you base your preference on a negative stereotype of those you didn't choose particularly if it is the group you are part of then I see it as a problem.

Evansaw said...

I think it is ok to 'Like what you like", but in the case of someone like Gerald, who seems to actually have something against Black women in general, this crosses the line to prejudice. I think Gerald is coming from a place of personal bias and Jake justs likes the vibe he gets from a sista. There is a big difference between preferring a particular type of women to vocally proclaiming a particular type to be "unworthy".

no_seriously? said...

I completely agree. I just hope he doesn't have daughters. We need women who love ALL of themselves, not more young women who hate a part of themselves. .

Guest said...

The whole topic pissed me off. Who are you to dictate who people should date?

Steve said...

I'm equal opportunity so I always wonder what makes someone rule out an entire group. I don't think any of them are necessarily racist but Gerald clearly has a few things he needs to work out.

Grace said...

Simply put - Women love the men who love (and appreciate) us back. So no, we're not going to try and convince Gerald that we are "less black" - we're going to smile when Jake comes over to say hi and we're going to tell all out friends about cute Dr. Wil.

Leo the Yardie Chick said...

As far as I'm concerned, people can date whatever package person they wish. It's their life, not mind. The ones that irritate the hell out of me are the ones who feel the need to justify their choice by belittling others at almost every step.

thinklikeRiley said...

Throat Chop direct to Gerald, hope he have 6 daughters who marry Mandingo. Self-hatin' bastid.
Fist bump to Wil.
Side eye to Jake. Jury's still out on ya, Vanilla Ice.

OneChele said...

The "low hanging fruit" line did it for me and revealed the depth of his confused pathology.

OneChele said...

I've yet to figure out how to act more or less black. And I'm okay with that.

MelaninEnriched said...

I guess my thought on having a "preference" for only dating INSIDE your race/culture/color is that no one EVER questions a White person, Asian person, Indian person, etc, for having a "preference" for someone that looks like them. I think it's almost ridiculous for someone to even bring up the fact that it'd be a negative to only date INSIDE one's race. I'm not opposed either way. I say do what you do and go for what you like, but to insinuate that there's something wrong with sticking to someone who looks like you or may share similar experiences with you is ludicrous and it seems only in the AA community is it even questioned as to whether that's a "right or wrong"

OneChele said...

I always say get love where you find love.

Jesse said...

This.

jake said...

I just wondered what the big deal was. People act like I must have some sort of ulterior motive for dating who I date. Can't I just like who I like. Damn, can I live?
For the record, Gerald was kind of a pr--k.

Leo the Yardie Chick said...

I don't even want to know what Gerald calls 'less black'.

OneChele said...

Excellent answer - thanks!

Max_Reddick said...

I have no qualms whatsoever about people choosing to date outside their race. I don't even think it's such a big deal when people state that they prefer to date people of a different race exclusively; I do, however, think that it is somewhat problematic.

But I do take exception when someone dates someone of the opposite race, and then reason that they do so by enumerating a long list of negative characteristics of that race, their very own. It is almost as if they have believed and made part of their consciousness every stereotype about themselves ever conceived.

OneChele said...

*snickers* And let me implore any sister in Atlanta who crosses Gerald's path to keep stepping.

OneChele said...

Packaging is subject to change anyway...

OneChele said...

SANE, CLEAN, NON CONTROLLING... I sense a story here ;-)

OneChele said...

"Less black, black enough, acts white, talks good, speaks so well, carries oneself well"... all code speak for some shiggity we are all too familiar with...

OneChele said...

I thought Wil's "cultural commonality" line was brilliant!

OneChele said...

I'm at the point where character and personality count more than strictly physical appearance. <~~~Preach on it.

OneChele said...

Well said chica.

OneChele said...

It's true that dropping shiggity on AA Females has been hot in the streetz for a minute so our tolerance is way low for any more shoveled in this direction. Which was why Jayme had to put me on mute when we were chatting to Gerald, I was going all the way left (and back around again). It's fine to date who you want but you don't have to insult one group to praise another. Sheesh.

OneChele said...

Generalizations are my least favorite things ever.

tiffanyinhouston said...

I'm back to add this: I wonder if Gerald is ballsy enough to tell his mama she's "low hanging fruit".

I doubt it.

OneChele said...

that doesn't mean I would be opposed to dating outside my race if the opportunity presented itself. <~~~ Excellent point, sir.

OneChele said...

And you would be correct.

OneChele said...

You may have missed my point. Actually... you totally missed it.

ASmith said...

Tell 'em why you mad,son. :)

Seriously, though, I hear you. I think people wonder if you have an ulterior motive because too many white men do. It's unfortunate but true that the sins of some color everyone in this situation.

Still #teamJake doe.

OneChele said...

Girrrl!

OneChele said...

The return of Max, ladies and gentlemen! *happy dances round BnB*

OneChele said...

*whispers* Why he gotta be Vanilla Ice, tho?

GrownAzzMan said...

"Side eye to Jake. Jury's still out on ya, Vanilla Ice"

This is why I am #teamriley

William Martin said...

*exhales* Okay, I didn't come off sounding like a complete idiot. Gerald had me heated though. He has completely bought into the ideal that somehow a white woman is to be revered and a black woman is to be reviled. I have a white grandmother and a black grandmother - how would I put one over the other?

Anyway, I've dated at least half the rainbow coalition and as stated, just settled into a preference. Never considered it racist until the chick on FB told me that with 12 exclamation points behind it. *Bougie shrug*
I'm going to borrow that line from Jake - I like what I like.

cocoaeyecandy said...

Are you blogging again, Max?

SingLikeSassy said...

Here's why Gerald irritates. The "low hanging fruit" comment suggests that he sees black women as less of a precious jewel than white women (since he exclusively dates them). Where Jake looks and sees a diamond he just sees coal. He sounds like a slave to me. Kick rocks G.

Since Dr. Wil is biracial I am a little surprised that he doesn't date multiculturally but, at least he offered a valid (to me and, obviously, to him) reason for his choice. We're good.

Personally, when I was dating I dated multiculturally, though admittedly my serious longtime relationships were with black men and my husband is black. That said, I'll be dating again soon and I plan to date multiculturally again. I have varied interests and experiences and like to learn something from my mate. I don't know that it's racist to date one race (unless you're Gerald), but I understand why people date exclusively within their own race.

bkbisous said...

Gerald-- who hurt you? I stand behind the thought that you may need some professional help. I can't even be upset with you, because I'm genuinely concerned.

Wil and Jake, I still haven't forgotten that y'all were quiet when asked to consider the ideal woman for you being outside your usual preference. That said, I understand positive preference, but letting your options run the gamut is so much fun!

datdudeincali said...

I remember Gerald, he was dude from your "They Quit Black People" Ask a Bougie Chick a few months back. Unfortunately he appears not to have learned a damn thing since that post. It's almost as if he wants us to convince him that black women are worth his time. Never mind all that. You just skate on by and let the rest of us handle that. Thank you very much.

Trudy said...

On the one hand, people need to date who they want, even if it is for the wrong reasons. This is a part of being an adult--making choices for whatever reason you choose.

On the other hand, I get annoyed with race and dating because I've encountered both Black and White men who seem to think they have right of first refusal and right of second refusal, respectively. I am not something on a shelf for Black men to discard and then next up is White. Uh, no. I've been to the other side of the planet so I know that men exist in more options than Black race American nationality and White race American nationality. The world is really bigger than just our concerns here in America.

It is unfortunate though that very few Black people can date outside of their race without hating the opposite gender of their race. I also do find it annoying talking to Black people who date in their race only and demonize those who date out of their race, often using rather annoying labels like "real man" "real woman" "king" and "queen" and other pomp and circumstance/circusdance instead of viewing each other as actual individuals, not part of the Borg. We don't have to be politically or racially motivated to date, and simply dating Black if we are Black does not "magically" improve our race our community. That takes work outside of who we are sleeping with.

Will should date whom he chooses. His preference does not seem hate-motivated. I think it is simply hard for a White woman to accept rejection. After all, she has thousands of years of history advising her that she should be preferred above others. She needs to let it go and move on. I don't get a racist vibe from his story. No one is "required" to date White simply because we are taught that this race is superior to all on the planet.

I will admit that Jake makes me a bit nervous, only because I have encountered many White men who brag about Black women sexually, yet hate most facets of Black culture, hate or are intimidated by Black men and aren't truly comfortable with Black people outside of their personal sexual interest with Black women. If this does not apply to him then more power to him and cool beans.

I have nothing to say about Gerald. His story is old and stale and I really have nothing new to add. Men like him do not anger me though, they honestly aren't and never were a real concern in my life, at least not since undergrad 10 years ago. Most men with views like this about Black women would not even talk to me (which is great, I don't want to talk to them...at all).

End of the day, no one owes anyone love, interest, sex, admiration, relationship, marriage...NOTHING. It's something earned. Some earn this through honorable means, some do not. This probably won't change.

JohnKinPDX said...

I'm with Tiffany in Houston below. Who the hell writes into a black female's blog and downs black females? That shows a distinct lack of intelligence and/or self-preservation. Damn son.

JohnKinPDX said...

"Half the rainbow coalition" - LMAO. What happened to the other half?

JohnKinPDX said...

I love a Bougie Cuss Out. So classy. Don't half realized you've been slapped down until later. Le Ouch?

MelaninEnriched said...

iDied. I'm a taking a dirt nap with a gritty blanket on that one.

MelaninEnriched said...

You don't have to worry about that. Actually, he wouldn't look my way anyway, so no problem!

Gerald said...

I feel fairly certain that the men on here are lying about their steadfast affiliation for black women. And I doubt the women here have the intellectual capacity to understand where I'm coming from. Just because I prefer white women does not mean I need professional help. You women need to accept that some men don't want you because of the way you are. Period

Diana said...

Well Gerald, I am a white woman and I DON'T understand what the hell you are talking about. I think you are filled with hate and bitterness and for the record, white women don't find that attractive either. I don't know what kind of weak-willed women you are finding to date you but I wish you luck. You know what - no I don't. I hope you end up the bitter old guy in Sunset Palms pinching nurses' asses and bribing orderlies for black market viagra. Jerk.

Leon X said...

Ellen Cleghorne approves of this comment.

FreeBlackMan said...

Ninja please. Keep your pathology to yo'self. WHERE IS YOUR MOTHER?
Don't presume to come up into BougieLand and tell us how we feel.
Boy GO. SIT. DOWN.

SingLikeSassy said...

What "way" is that? What are all these things you don't like that has turned you off black women and caused you to exclusively date white women?

MelaninEnriched said...

"...yet hate most facets of Black culture, hate or are intimidated by Black men and aren't truly comfortable with Black people outside of their personal sexual interest with Black women."
Outside of the sexual references quite honestly, this sounds more like Gerald than Jake, based on Gerald's own admission and implications.

That assumption about Jake is a generalization based on your personal experiences. I have personally rarely experienced WM who brag about BW sexually. Men brag about women sexually (no matter the race/culture) and I haven't noticed it being any worse coming from a WM than a BM, but that's another matter altogether.

Mykeia said...

Good day to you Gerald,
It seems as if you have read some of the comments...how does one really dislike black women? I am sure in your short life time you have not met every black woman, we are not all the same.
Preference is preference, however, the bashing and blaming of black women should cease, if it does your point of preference may be taken more seriously and may hold some validity.

MelaninEnriched said...

Wow, so just because YOU have issues with BW or issues with yourself, which I think it more accurate, you're trying to invalidate the preference for BW that other men have. You truly are a piece of work. I say the WW can have you! You can be somebody else's problem.

But of course, if someone didn't want to date you (as a BM) because of "the way you are" (and we know the negative stereotypes associated), that'd be a problem, for you I'm sure. Ha!

Pure Choco said...

Did he really just say "intellectual capacity"??? This blog probably has more degreed (university and school of life) people that many others. How smart does a girl need to be to recognize you for what you really are.

Ms. Jay said...

Excuse me , we dont have the intellectual capacity to understand where you come from ? Please sir , get your head out of your butt. And please do not insult any of our intelligence with that bullshiggity comment

blackprofessor said...

Hey, how are you doing?

Trudy said...

It's not my own personal experience alone, but collective stories of those I know, articles, stories and more when I mention this. I didn't allude to that since I was writing just my view, but it is more than my view. To pretend that the sexualization of Black women by White men doesn't exist because Jake might be a nice guy wouldn't be accurate. But true, it may not apply to him specifically, and I stated that and said "cool beans" if it doesn't. If it does not that is great!

Good point regarding the fact that Gerald may view it that way more than Jake, but for him it is not just sexual prize but perhaps the belief that simply being with her makes him "better." White men don't need to date anyone to "feel" better as a White patriarchal capitalist society places them at the proverbial top already. This is why perhaps the sexual references dominate conversations with (some of) them. True, men brag about women sexually regardless of race, but to pretend that the motivations are the same from man to man irrespective of culture wouldn't be accurate.

Nandiehills said...

'And I doubt the women here have the intellectual capacity to understand where I'm coming from.'---- WOW! You really are a self-hating individual aren't you? I can't believe you would even have the nerve to come up in here and insult the woman of BougieLand! The Cheek! And you know what...YOU DO NEED professional help, not for your preference of white women but for some seemingly unresolved and underlying issues you may have.

blackprofessor said...

I meant to say that I remembered you from that post regarding your fiance and wanted to inquire but I type to fast.

Michele said...

So, now your saying that all the BM in Bougieland really prefer WW?

Nandiehills said...

And for the record.... I didn't like your comment. I just clicked the wrong button.

Bethany Showell said...

Seriously, professional help. B/t the self-hatred and the misogyny SOMEthing is going on that ain't just "oh I like white women". That there is a well-deserved recipe for bitter and alone in the long run.

blackprofessor said...

Tell me that you are fabricated, because you sound like the biggest caricature of the angry BM, I have ever read!

Intellectual capacity??? I.just.can't with your passive aggressive jabs that you don't even understand. I didn't go in on you below because I actually feel sorry for you and KNOW that you need serious therapy though I agree with my fellow sisters. At any rate, please run to the nearest White woman becasue that is one less idiot in the smart and sane dating pool, which I happen to belong to. Your mama must be so ashamed.

Mr. Skyywalker said...

Gerald... dude. "You know you done f*cked up, right?"
*points and laughs*

Miz JJ said...

Why is Gerald even on this web site? Shouldn't he be busy worshipping at the feet of the almighty white woman? Why engage with black women who are "low hanging fruit" and do not possess "the intellectual capacity" to understand the deep, deep, complexity, which is Gerald? Newsflash Gerald, you are not complex. You are actually quite transparent. Meaning, I see through you and men like you. I know that you can not hate black women without hating yourself. If your own self-hatred weren't so pathetic it would be sad.

SingLikeSassy said...

Gerald is just baiting us. Stop feeding the troll.

William Martin said...

I'm sorry to say that Gerald sounds JUST like that IRL. Angry Black Man syndrome much?

Trudy said...

Perhaps some do, but I don't specifically need random Black men to desire or accept me in order to feel value in myself. I don't exclusively date you all, I don't chase you all...nothing. I think people should choose how they may, for right or wrong reasons, but the wrong reason choosers need to lay off the insults.

However, you are entirely too comical to use the phase "intellectual capacity." That's just funny. I don't see how anyone could be angry about that because once you go there, you're grasping for straws. Date whom you choose but to suggest that your view is so complex that others, women particularly, cannot understand it is almost pee in the pants laughable. Seriously. Come on son....

superwoman said...

okay, okay, i know it's a serious and heated topic and all that - but i am still picking myself up from the floor from laughing till i cried after reading this line...

"Jake may have called him an unrepeatable name."

bua ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!! okay, moment over - lemme go finish reading article, and catch up on these EIGHTY EIGHT POSTS from clearly irate readers!!! crikey!!! i think you touched a nerve with this one, Chele....

OneChele said...

I hope you end up the bitter old guy in Sunset Palms pinching nurses' asses and bribing orderlies for black market viagra. Jerk. <~~~ Game. Set. Match. Diana FTW!

Sunset Palms tho?! Ha!

JCam said...

Great Topic Chele,

In regards to all three men mentioned in the post -- do you.

You're grown and this is America.

My only "concern," is that finding someone who loves you unconditionally for who you are and who compliments you and vice versa, isn't easy. It's possible that one could miss Mrs/Mr. Right because they're not in the package we're expecting/used to.

My only issue with Gerald is this:

My brother, why denigrate to validate?

You prefer White women, that's wonderful.

However, there is no need to put an entire group of people down to validate your preference. I would much prefer you extol White women as opposed to badmouthing black women.

And also, why come out of the gate with insults ("I doubt the women on here have the intellectual capacity...") - really?

The only person your comment really reflects negatively upon is you. Bad manners much?

We respect each other here in Bougieland, we ask that you do the same :)

JohnKinPDX said...

Compared to Joking Gerald over there, I am golden. :-)
No really thanks for asking. I'm good. Single and mad about relinquishing $12k in wedding deposits. But good.

superwoman said...

you poor, poor fool.....

tonyette79 said...

Gerald, I'm going to be one of the only people who will actually attempt to listen to whatever "reasons" you may have for deciding that all of the Black women in the entire United States of America are "not worth the trouble" as you put it. There has to be a valid reason that you can give that would deem an entire group of women "un-Gerald-worthy". The odd thing to me is that I have a mother, a stepmother, a sister, two sisters-in-law, thirteen aunts, approximately 10 first female cousins and about 10 ladies that I'd consider to be very close friends. All of the aforementioned women are Black. There are countless other women I know who are Black. The ONLY things that we ALL have in common are having been born female and Black! There is not one, literally NOT ONE, thing that we ALL have in common besides the two aforementioned things. Some are single; some are married. Some are heterosexual; some homosexual. Some are Christians; some have no religious affiliation. Some can cook; some do better to order out. Some are sweet, loving, warm & nurturing; some are ice cold due to life's hard trials. Some have master's degrees; some haven't finished high school. My point, Gerald, is that if you were to use my circle of Black women as a small sample of ALL of Black women in the US, you'd see that there is nothing common among us all to count out the entire group. I personally see nothing wrong with a preference. And if you had simply said something trivial like "White women are prettier" I'd have simply laughed at what I consider foolish thinking. If you'd said "I can't relate to Black women" I'd have appreciated the honesty in that...and just asked why you felt that way. I was vacillating between using big words to "prove" my intellectual capacity to you and "going off" proclaiming that in your childhood you were probably mocked for being nerdy/ugly/too dark/too light (pick one!) and then asking if that's what you meant by not being "...worth the trouble". I decided, instead, to be somewhere in the middle, trying to figure out where you could possibly be coming from. But...I keep coming up empty!

'Chele (first time commenting, I think! LOVE the blog!) , I personally have a problem when anyone says "I only date..."even if its your own race. I would ask a person why he or she wouldn't allow him or herself to be more open. I can understand a preference. I prefer Black guys, but I'm not opposed to dating outside my race.

CreoleInDC said...

So is it racist to only consider one particular race in your dating pool? Most of the time this isn't the case but hey...sometimes it could very well be. Most folks date folks that share their same skin color because it's the most natural thing in the world. When folks decide to date ONLY folks that don't share their skin color it's unnatural to me because it's like rejecting who you are. Being accepting of dating folks for the sole reason that you were attracted to them regardless of skin color is what dating should be all about IN MY OPINION.

What's the difference between a preference and prejudice? Prejudice is when you won't consider dating someone of another skin color because you believe their race is beneath you and therefore not up to the standards you think are superior to someone of your skin color. Add further confusion to this by adding that yes...Blacks can be prejudice against other Blacks just as Whites can be prejudice against other Whites. LOL! Confucious eh? Usually these types of prejudices are boiled down to economics and/or self-hate.

Preference is when you want someone to have certain traits and qualities regardless of their skin color.

Who's right? I'm right. LOL!

Who's wrong? Nobody if they can find someone that fits their quals. What folks fail to understand is that no matter how much hemming and hawing we may do about someone else doing them the way they want to do them...hell...they still gonna get it how they live.

Who's rolling with Wil, Jake or Gerald? I'm with Wil and Jake. They like what they like. Wil not dating a White chick and Jake not dating a White chick doesn't mean those White chicks will be denied happiness and basic civil rights. LOL! Go date someone who wants you! Simple. Gerald? *sigh* Imma leave that dude be.

And what would you do if your perfect mate came in an unexpected package? I struggled with it for a long time but realized that God was testing me. I'd asked Him to send me the perfect man for me and had a list as long as the Israeli Palestinian conflict. God sent me the man I asked Him for in a package that I was unfamiliar with dating because I didn't think I needed to specify that he be Black. Hey...I thought God knew that since I'd never dated anyone that wasn't Black before. Well...I stopped fighting it and feeling weird and allowed things to take their natural course. I love my husband more than anything and his actions and words show me he feels the same about me. I'm glad I got over my issues and trusted what God sent to me which is pure happiness and the perfect man FOR ME. So...what would I do? I married him. :)

JaymeC said...

What I love [sarcasm] is how it's always the most deeply troubled folks saying they don't need help.
Um-hmm. Okay. We see you.

Diggame said...

I don't think it is a problem for someone to have a preference as long as they are not knocking or clowning another race of women. I will say the brother Gerald saying he doesn't want to be bothered and other "sistas" aint ish statements are a problem. But having a preference is nothing wrong with that in a general state.

OneChele said...

Welcome out of lurkerland and well said.

OneChele said...

Standing Ovation for the clinical breakdown. Get it!

Mykeia said...

Le Ouch!! On the deposits...Where was the venue, if I may ask?

Paul on Ice said...

My last two girlfriends were white, the one before that black. If I'm attracted and she's feeling me back, that's what I'm rolling with. I don't consciously stop and think "Now I'd like to try vanilla, please" no. Dating is so much availability and circumstance anyway, you can't really fault someone for dating what's around them.

But yo boy Gerald is on some other ish. Someone did something to him as a child or young man that has him twisted.

rochee said...

Why did anyone respond to this dude? It is clear that he is doing this to get a rise out of everyone...and guess what?...it is working...He just wants us to make him feel special by engaging his foolishness. "Oh Gerald, you are so special and amazing and we black women are missing out on you. Please choose us! Pretty please! We won't know what to do without you and your social retardation."...Yeah I don't care about this fool. Whichever dumb broad chooses his self-hating behind can have him. I bet he is an impotent, nerdy, and wack jerk. NEXT!

jake said...

I feel like you made this a little more complex than need be. And someone let the record reflect that I did not bring up the cocoa. Anyway, interesting analysis.

rozb said...

Um - wow "Gerald" - if that's your name. Seems to me that to make statements that are inflammatory in nature and at their very best ill-conceived only serves to set up a little controversy and start some ratched mess. With that said, there is nothing wrong with having a preference but there is something inherently in you that you must blame the shortcomings in your own life dealings that it MUST be an entire race of women that is at fault. I mean, Gerald, really. You are just recycling that stale tired rhetoric and engaging in tired buffoonery to just start some mess.

"Just because I prefer white women does not mean I need professional help. You women need to accept that some men don't want you because of the way you are. Period" Seems to me that if this is how you really feel, then trolling a site and engaging an audience made up of mainly Black women means you are seeking some sort of help or validation, or something. So please, be a troll somewhere else. I really can't with the fake "I would rather date White women" drivel. It is tired and old, and I didn't just get over bronchitis to look at you act a fool.

To everybody else - hey y'all! I'm baaaaaack!

MidWestDominicana said...

Actually, I hope he doesn't have any children at all...at least not until his mind gets all the way right. Don't need anymore people feeling this way, period.

rochee said...

You summed this whole thing up perfectly. Very well said. Black women are diverse. We are not monolithic. The same goes for black men. The same also goes for white men. The same goes for everyone. To lump us all together is purely idiotic and it is indicative of a myopic mind. If the black women on this thread were to follow Gerald's logic, we would all write off black men. Because aren't they all uneducated, illiterate, lazy, jobless, irresponsible, neglectful fathers, players, riddled with disease, jail bound, jail exiting losers? We need to stop generalizing and use some common sense.

JohnKinPDX said...

The Governor Hotel

SingLikeSassy said...

OK, I have one more thing to say (that's prolly one of those black women "ways" you don't like isn't it? LOL!).

ANYWAY, this statement right here -->"I feel fairly certain that the men on here are lying about their steadfast affiliation for black women."

This is an anonymous forum. I don't know these dudes. Do you? Why would they need to lie here where they can type whatever they like just as you have? That makes no sense to me.

Rob said...

Whoa. Just whoa. Just tipped through BougieLand to see what's what. All hell broke loose up in here. I miss movie week when only 12 people had an opinion ;-)
Why should a person even have to state their dating preferences. If Gerald likes Becky, go get her and be about your way.
If Jake wants Peaches, get it in. Wil seem more like the Priscilla type - I ain't hatin'
Do you and keep it to yourself. (Please Gerald, keep it to yourself)

Leo the Yardie Chick said...

That sounds like a classy location. Hopefully, one day you'll find a better woman who will appreciate it. :)

Sol_dier said...

'It' just wants attention.

I hereby give you permission to go forth and love up the vanilla sisters (well with the exception of Diana, as she doesn't seem to want you).
You don't need a reason not to want the chocolate sisters, its cool. We don't mind at all. Would you like some help leaving us alone?, cos we would really like to speedily assist you on your way.

We accept that we are far removed from your standard, I won't indicate in which direction (not bougie).
We also accept that we do not have the intellectual capacity to unravel your psychosis, this is not something we are interested or aiming to acquire.

Thanks so much for stopping by, we would love to chat about other topics, but we presume that you don't have time as you have a bevy of vanilla sisters lined up for intellectual acrobatics.
WE APPLAUD YOU and your wise decision.

Would you mind leaving quietly, so that we can carry on with our simplistic discussions which would only bore you.

oh scuse us. Jake, Will and Diana are on their way for some simplistic bougie meanderings

Thanks and goodnight.

Sol_dier said...

The elders used to say....
Controversy equalizes fools and wise men -- and the fools know it.

Farrod said...

Love my sisters, for real...at the moment tho'...it's like, 'can't live wit em, can't live without 'em'

GammasWorld said...

I knew when I read the blog at work that y'all was gonna be riled up LOL. Little did I know that "Gerald" was going to be doing the riling. As we used to say back in the day down south - "I ain't studding him". I've never dated outside my race, but I am not opposed to it. If love came a knocking in the body of a man of another race well then let me be the first to say come on in. I have 2 white sisters-in-law. Being the only girl of 4 brothers, I always thought them marrying would finally get me the sister my parents denied me. Honestly my only disappointment when bros bought 'em home was I won't have a sister to help me with my hair. Their marriages have lasted long past mine so I ain't mad at 'em and I've got a bunch of nieces and nephews who date whoever the hell they want. I'll never forget when my oldest niece was little one of her little white friends asked her why her dad was black - she said that's the way God made him and they went their merry way. Out of the mouths of babes. Prejudice vs. preference has been covered ... y'all (except for Gerald) know the deal LOL.

David Chase said...

No one is easy. Sisters don't play, nor do women of other races. You step up to the plate, bring your best game and swing for the fences. Now if you don't measure up (Gerald) you are excused from the game. But don't lament your slot in the rotation or the players on the field. It is what it is. Go hard or go home.
(Too many sports metaphors?) Y'all knew what I meant.

Sol_dier said...

good to have you back Rozb.
I know its terribly un-bougie but sometimes I do like to watch the court jester at play..
Its especially hilarious when no-one rises to the bait and they are left stamping their feet, and saying more and more outlandish things like a child throwing a temper tantrum.

Amusing for a little while... no?

GammasWorld said...

Oh I'm Team Jake and Team Wil -- they like what they like and that's all it is to it. I get the sense from both of them they don't "HATE" the other race (Gerald) and that's the difference between preference and prejudice.

Troy said...

Lately the only ladies checking for me are of the pale variety. I was surprised how many evil eyes the sistas sent my way when I stepped out with Becky on the arm. One girl in particular who turned me down TWO weeks earlier was like, "Oh, it's like that huh." But wait?! I asked you out first and you said no. Brother supposed to sit at home waiting for a change of mind? It's complicated out there.

rozb said...

Actually...yeah!

All Honey said...

I'm #TeamDudeWhoisNotaJerkFilledwithSelfHate :-/
Way to kick off the week, Chele. Whew.

aishao1122 said...

Im late I know but here it goes. Im Jamaican "Out of many, one people" is our motto, our national saying and if you have ever met a Jamaican the "irie vibe" is pretty much how we roll. Now Im a soror and i have dated and married the 'right guy" (read correct frat letters) for me, and then grew up and realized marrying letters was stupid, so we split ( we were better friends and still are anyway).
Since then I have dated many flavors of men, but have noticed
1) Caribbean men love the darker women
2) I get more play from white guys since I went natural with my hair, and the reverse from black guys when I had my hair braided to look "long"
3) European men love their women thicker than American men.
No judgement people have their preferences and that their business, whatever floats your boat. The current S/O(s) are white and native american, and although we may not click culturally, there are many more aspects in which we agree (spiritually, and politically).
As for Jake go ahead and love who you love, same to Will, Gerald perhaps needs to stay by himself and think about what it is about the women he keeps attracting that makes him dislike black women, if it's the ghetto girls, move on up, if you just plain don't like black women, then do you, just don't attempt to drag all black women down because a few may have dogged you out.
(didn't read the comments before I posted so forgive me if I repeated anything anyone said)

Andy Hopper said...

Now that I've read and am caught up on all 119 comments, I shall inserts my two cents... I'm def on team Will and Jake for many of the same reasons already stated; they like who they like and aren't trying to put anyone else down to do that...

But, it does irritate me that other people think it is their right to comment/judge others people's dating preferences. As a black caribbean woman I didn't always gravitate toward dating black men. Dating black men wasn't out of the question but I seemed to have a thing for Latino men. Nonetheless, black men went out of their way at times to call me out for not dating brothers....

Truth be told, people like Gerald (and Will and Jake, for that matter) wouldn't have to justify their preferences if people would mind their business in the first place. Black women need to cut it out with the "side-eye" and stop taking it personally when a black man shows up with a white woman on his arm... Black men need to stop telling black women that they are weak and can't handle a "real" man because they went the way of Fabio...White men need to stop accusing their peers of "slumming" because they are not feeling Becky... I could keep going but I think ya'll get the point.

Do you and don't worry about how I do me!

P.S. I used to say that I wouldn't date caribbean men because of the womanizing I witness while growing up. Wouldn't you know that the love of my life was born and bread in the Caribbean. Who would have thought!

mojitochica said...

You can click it again and revoke your like.

Mr. Sable said...

Aw, c'mon! I've got the very same story as Jake (other than I'm 42 now and not 29). I've tried all the flavours, but I like the Black ladies best. I don't dislike *any* race, but I just find Black ladies the most attractive and interesting and therefore appealing.

ASmith said...

Wait. Is this for real?

Oh. Aight den. Thanks for sharing, bro.

Truth is, I think you know what you're saying is really messed up. I think either you refuse to admit that or think it's hilarious to watch people argue over it. But you know -- you have to know -- your sentences are too grammatically correct for you to be less than an intelligent man, so I know you know. So I can know that you know and then we can know together.

ASmith said...

This was #everything and I NEEDED to tell you that.

maureen palmer said...

There is nothing wrong dating black or white, but when you do it at the expense of black or white woman/man then there is a problem.
I had an Asian boss that dated white men only. first foward 5 years later when she is was thinkinig of settling down, according to her she had "Aha" moment and wanted to be with man with similar culture/values as her. She is a foodie, and she found out that most of her white men did appreciate the kind of food she enjoyed, this is one among many other things that led to her to revaluate dating pool.

Cassie said...

Wow!! I'm late to the dance, everything's been said and said well.

Cassie said...

I feel you, Farrod.

Sarah said...

Poor Wil. First, it's your Mom's friend and now all these women mobbing you and not taking no for an answer. How about you direct them to Chele's post on the Rabbit and the Hunter. You could tell them that you prefer woman you have to chase and see how that works out :-)

I'd say Wil and Jake sound like they have a healthy thought process and Gerald, why are you here?

If you lined up my exs, they don't look anything alike. I haven't ever put any thought into what my type is. I like kindness, a sense of humor, a sense of purpose, and someone who is good to hug. None of the relationships were planned. They just happened. I just can't see why people think they have a choice who they are attracted to. You can be attracted to somebody and decide you can't or won't have them in your life for whatever reason. But you can't decide you find somebody attractive or at least I can't. I'm all for minding my own business. I just want people to be happy :-)

T Lynnk said...

Gerald is different for the reasons he states. He makes his own self sound different, he's not highlighting his preferance, he kinda sounds a little salty cause he likes the sistas but can't find one to his preference...too bad, cause I know alot of them...

But in reality there's not difference, I prefer the brothers that love the sistas and the ones that don't are free not to for whatever reason, they just don't have to go all out trying to put us on blast about it, dang, we are ALL different!

Natasha Smith said...

(I know I should read the previous comments to ensure I'm not repetitive, but that's a lot of comments!)

What's the difference? It's all in the packaging. Wil and Jake are expressing their preferences FOR a type/race of women. Gerald is stating his preferences AGAINST a race of women.

I have my list of qualities I'd like to see in my future mate. When I stick to that list, the men I date have been white. Usually, the Black men who approach me don't come close to meeting my desired expectations. Does that mean I won't date a black man? Of course not!

md_KG said...

ooh good to have you back rozb. Glad you're feeling so much better now.

Iced_Coffee_Sweet_Tea_Diva said...

*raises hand* Dear Guest, please get a GPS and take your prickly 'tude to the blog for clueless cacti. Thank you.

BrendaKay said...

Sorry I'm late to the party, but my parents, baby sister and beloved nephew are all sick with the flu and I'm playing nurse.

At 52 years old, I consider myself to be a member of the "Mature Bougie Brigade" and of the many things that I've learned over the years, one thing stands out ~ People waste so much of their lives trying to live for other people and doing what they think will make everyone else proud.

Date, love, marry, sex who you want. It's not my business and I promise not to be mad at you. :-) I'm living my life as I choose. And unless I ask for someone's opinion or advice on a particular matter, all other unsolicited comments are ignored with a withering cold stare. Matter of fact, on off chance an alien race landed on Earth tomorrow and some interesting blue green guy with red dots asked me out. Then I'm going to wiggle into my comfortable jeans, a nice winter sweater, slap some make up on, and hope that the date doesn't end like that classic "Twilight Zone" episode, "To Serve Man". :-)

If your criteria for choosing a life partner is based solely on race to the exclusion of other far more important aspects. Then the odds of you of having a happy, long lasting marriage is pretty much up there with winning one of those record setting MegaMillions jackpot.

May I suggest that we all leave Gerald standing next to that glove and mullet wearing "Rent is too high" butt clown as they lovingly stare at the object of their wet dreams, Sarah Palin.

Iced_Coffee_Sweet_Tea_Diva said...

Lord, please give us the satisfaction of letting a black female relative of Gerald's read his comments, and let try to help him instead of slapping the taste out of his mouth. In the name of the sisterhood of life-giving WOMEN of intelligence, Amen.

Iced_Coffee_Sweet_Tea_Diva said...

Team William and Team Jake all day, and bravo Team Diana! Gerald's got issues - how can you dismiss black women without noticing that you have dismissed yourself??? Seriously, hope that you work on that self-hatred thing before it takes you down. I have dated within and outside of the race, and been dropped by black men for women within and outside of the race. *shrugs* Lesson learned: when it gets to be about the skin color and not about the person, it's time to step. When it's about the person who didn't get to vote on that skin color they are draped in, it can be a lot of fun. We spend too much time with our antenna up sweeping for racial slights and sometimes we miss cultivating the friends that we 'would otherwise consider'. One of my favorite cousins married a white woman who became family because she was comfortable with being herself. We didn't forget that she was white, we just remembered that we loved her. And it should be that way with everyone.

C Nelson said...

I'm so glad I didn't see this till just now. After wrestling half the day with people who think a pharmacist should have the right to not fill a prescription to keep a woman from bleeding to death *and* not let her take her prescription somewhere else because he thinks she might be bleeding because of an abortion, I didn't have the energy for another fool who thinks some subsection of women lack value.

Our preferences aren't formed in a vacuum. They don't come to us packaged in our DNA -- we pick them up, much like our food preferences, from what we're exposed to, more than we usually think about. If you eat curry three times a week, grilled chicken tastes bland. If you've only ever had cinnamon on sweets, you're in for a shock when someone serves you pastisio. I think anyone who rules out a whole population of potential mates is likely to be either conforming to the white-centric beauty ideals we get fed, or rebelling against/actively rejecting them. Neither one of those things is inherently bad, unless we take it to ridiculous extremes. Neither of them, though, is ideal; ideal would be for race to be a non-issue entirely. People fall short of ideal all the time though; comes with being human.

Wil, Jake -- seems like y'all have figured out how to split much of the dating pool between you without pulling faces at each other's choices. That works. Gerald ... it's rude, if nothing else, to comment negatively about what someone else has chosen to put on their plate. You don't want it, don't take it. (Please, don't take it. The fewer women you subject to your opinions, the better.) Disparaging remarks, though, would have gotten you a hand to your backside in my house by way of proper upbringing. I hope that is too black for you -- if it isn't, please do let me know and I'll dish up something that will be.

ETA -- I fail at closing tags.

CaliGirlED said...

Hey md_KG, thanks for asking about me! It's been very trying for me these past few weeks with my little brother being hospitalized. I read a few posts but was just too emotionally drained to comment. And this one here is toooo much for me. I just shake my head at Gerald.

GammasWorld said...

Almost 50 and love the Mature Bougie Brigade ... can I join?

keishabrown said...

probably Gerald in disguise....

keishabrown said...

*falls off couch. riley strikes again.

keishabrown said...

I think it is simply hard for a White woman to accept rejection. After all, she has thousands of years of history advising her that she should be preferred above others. She needs to let it go and move on. <-THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

as for your analysis of Jake...I understand what you are saying. I've been the chocolate experiment for a white dude before - but we only know each other electronically, not in 3D, so I cant infer any insight to how he lives his live (#NoTI)

keishabrown said...

yikes. sorry about the financial loss...

keishabrown said...

THIS. entire post.
*bangs imaginary judge gavel

keishabrown said...

EXACTLY.
there are strong women of all shades, and weak women of all shades. just as there are PLENTY of vanilla sisters that would push OG into the river, there are some Black women with low self esteem, willing to accept any man that hollas.
want quality? be quality.

keishabrown said...

EXACTLY.
there are strong women of all shades, and weak women of all shades. just as there are PLENTY of vanilla sisters that would push OG into the river, there are some Black women with low self esteem, willing to accept any man that hollas.
want quality? be quality.

keishabrown said...

i want to know how you pulled having TWO s/o's...
dont think you got that past!! lol ;)

kjnetic aka Peter Parker said...

ehh, i'm late.

what if Wil and Jake thought the same way about their preferences that Gerald thought about his...

but "knew better" than to frame it in the same terms as Gerald did?

what if Gerald had simply said, "I like what I like"?

Adonis said...

See, I have no problem with Gerald...Alot of Black Women are damaged goods... & I can only imagine what drove him to the point where he felt like black women are not even an option anymore... But my sisters to that to alot of the men... It's one thing if black women were near perfect & we are just sh*tting on them... I would understand... But when you do an thorough investigation then you are like "If I was Gerald I would date non-black women too"...

So you can go kick rocks too @Rochheejeffrey

Adonis said...

Again stereotypes are stereotypes for a REASON... whether unfair or not... rise above your stereotypes, they are not going away... I don't mind if a person uses a stereotype to guide his decisions in dating... We all react on stereotypes to some degree...

Gerald is the man... God Bless Him... Maybe if we boycott all the Ratchet black women... maybe they will mature and it wouldn't be so hard to find a wifable black woman

Adonis said...

Agreed... Gerald just needs to keep digging through the myriads of black women who do not fit his program & find one who matches what he is looking for

Adonis said...

Cause he still likes black women, he is just sick of all the bs most of the sistas bring... (that answer is easy)

Adonis said...

good post

Adonis said...

I agree with that... Gerald really wants to work it out with black women...

Adonis said...

Good Post... I love the POV

Adonis said...

I wish most women date that way, but you'll be surprised how much character & personality take a back seat to superficial things

Adonis said...

I wish I was on the chat...

Adonis said...

(Ad Hominem) That was a sucka thing to say... point blank

Adonis said...

Agreed... Black women, beauty & feeling are the best hands down...

Adonis said...

Jake... I'm happy the you prefer the same women I do... (alot of them are single and looking) But stop throwing salt on Gerald... It is not like he is being unreasonable with BW... Just bless your black sistas with that good white D & treat them like the queens they deserve to be treated (assuming that they are respecting you)...

Adonis said...

See when I look my mother or my grandmother, I don't see the characteristics of them in the black women of today... But I felt like blackwomen were low hanging fruit... (you know how the story ends...)

Adonis said...

Yeah, to say white women are better than black women are asinine... cause that is not true... But if black women are giving you hell, and white women are giving you relief, what would you choose... #CmonSon

Adonis said...

That is because Gerald is the mothaeffin man... He kept it real... unadulterated & bw as usual couldn't handle it...

I'm back after reading the comments and I'm stuck on Gerald. I'm wondering if the black women (woman?) he did date sensed his bitterness and contempt, and reacted accordingly, which served to reinforce his negative view of black women? Either way, I feel sorry for Gerald.

This is why harboring contempt & bitterness is a bad idea....

Adonis said...

Nice Post... I like

Adonis said...

Agreed... Gerald has been the man in this comment section... I didn't get to throw salt on the white girls... now they need to go kick rocks... Trust me, their are enough eligible black men that will abandon black women she will have her pick of the litter...

Good Post Keisha

Adonis said...

That was his only CRIME... good point... Now, I would beat his a*s for THAT

Adonis said...

My black mothers need to stop producing #Simps & #CaptainSaveAH*es...

Adonis said...

This is similar to what the KeishaBrown argument on another post... Despite the bs that bw bring, I still entertain the good ones, they are just so rare (in NYC)... (and on blogs)

Adonis said...

There are too many educated fools walking around on the planet (coming from an educated a*shole)
So Gerald's point does hold some weight

Adonis said...

Self-Hating!?!?!? I respectfully disagree
... Because you threw no insults I can't be any more immature than I was with Diana... But Gerald shouldn't have said that... I wish I could apologize on his behalf for that remark

Adonis said...

I agree with the only date one race thing... And I like the whole family sharing... And the fact THAT YOU EVEN GAVE GERALD a somewhat fair hearing...

But let's not pretend that there is an abundance of good black women worth marrying GTFOHWTBS...

I'm saving my comments for the bottom

Adonis said...

If I was a BW... I would write off most BM... and cherish the good ones that do grace my presence (anyways movin' on)

Adonis said...

Love that

Adonis said...

get well soon

Adonis said...

co-sign

Adonis said...

nice David Chase... Go hard or go home

Adonis said...

I wish more black men & women actually took this advice in dating BUT (oh well)

Adonis said...

And what i am saying that a high quality American Black Woman is as rare as the mythical good black man

Adonis said...

THANK YOU... i'm like whatever h*e

Adonis said...

I beg to differ, i love p*ssing black women off showing up with the white woman especially WHEN I TRIED TO HOLLA AT YOU FIRST... Now, I know that no person have a rebuttal for that... Women in general play alot of games, but all the ish stops when you have your money, clothes & smooth talk going and they see you with BADDER looking women than them (again I tried to holla at you, but you were on some BS)

Adonis said...

I agree

md_KG said...

You're most welcome! Sorry to hear about your little brother. Hope he's doing much better now.

Adonis said...

I'm so mad that I made it late to this dance... But better late than never...

I am going to be Gerald for a moment... Because I feel like I am him (except I am not)

Why I would write off most sistas

Attitude/Diva Complex (In NYC, most people don't even SMILE, & the black women I am attracted to are quick to emasculate you even if you are coming at the m in a "respectful" tone)

Kids at a young age... Alot of black women at least have one child (18-25) & they have never been married... You will get some d*ck, but no ring... I need my girls to be childless (I have no kids)

Overweight - No this isn't really an issue... because I love thick sistas... But when I see overweight people... it shows me you have a lack of discipline & chances are you are not at least striving to reach your ideal weight (in light of the fact that men are visual creatures)

They Don't Value Good Men At A Young Age... Alot of older women on this blog would jump at the chance of having a good man by their side (or already have a good man by their side)... But most of these black women date thugs... Guys like me are destined for non-black women, because she is not attracted to me until I end up dating a white girl... (why don't women address this, send me a link to the blog that does) & they end up making the mistake getting pregnant by sorry a*s n*ggas... And then uses me as a back-up plan GTFOHWTBS There is no incentive to being a Good Black Man... or a Good Man Period... Beat the p*ssy up, & let her chase after you...

You can't criticize black women for the better - Anytime you point out the bs in black women, they deflect, the spew Ad Hominems do everything else but improve their stock... At least with the sorry a*s n*gga I can corner him & he can admit he ain't sh*t, not with black women... To get a chance at changing them, you have to coddle them & walk a fine line if you want to get them to change...

Wifability in black women is at an all time low... (maybe with women in general)

Now granted, I haven't met all American Black Women or even European Black Women or all bw... so yea my POV will evolve... But when I have to the bs I just outlined here... I can see why Gerald said "f*ck it..." and he shouldn't be despised for it... But BW have LOW self esteem so any type of criticism that is thrown their way is seen as an attack...

Now maybe instead of getting flagged to death... or being insulted How about a coherent discussion on how we are gonna improve the quality of black women so guys like me won't feel like I need to turn to Becky...

Let's improve black women so, she can be seen as the standard of what a woman should be, and stop worrying about the white chick (she ain't ish either, and most likely ain't a ring from me, a black girl stands a far better chance...)

So I end this with in reference to black women... The Odds Are Good, But The Goods Are Odd... Let's stop acting like black women are these wonderful women that are being ished on by the Gerald's of the world

Adonis said...

And not ot mention as a good black man... I get penalized for expressing interest in a chick... no incentive to be a male with romantic feelings... Get the p*ssy first, beat it up a few times, then show some interest...

Sol_dier said...

Adonis..

I really APPLAUD YOU. I think you have the right idea and I as a black woman would like to personally approve and validate your choice of dating the vanilla sisters (Beckys)

I think it would be soo counterproductive of you to be attracted to or even consider people who are just not on the same wavelength as you, I mean why would you even care about women who:
- don't smile at random strangers on the mean streets of NYC,
- lack self esteem,
- only want to date thugs, have low stock value,
- have a Diva complex,
- children out of wedlock,
- don't value good men e.t.c.

Anyone in their right mind would RUN and RUN FAST away from such women.
So RUN Adonis, don't try to save anyone. It is hopeless. and you will be wasting your time.

But then, as you have stated in your post, black women don't like you and you don't like them... so its a win win situation.

You should go live your life and not be bothered by these unredeemable black women.

- Signed on behalf of Black Women.

Sol_dier said...

well...
Wil and Jake didn't.
Gerald did.

We deal with actualities not supposition.

Sol_dier said...

of course.. you would. I presume you recognise which side you belong.....

kjnetic aka Peter Parker said...

after reading all the comments..

you know what? you're right. Let me get some more rocks, so y'all can kick rocks at Gerald (and i guess, Adonis).

but before i hand y'all these rocks to kick at 'em, can i say that if people develop preferences, and don't "like who they like", then the preferences of Gerald didn't happen in a vacuum.

i know it would be cool and sh** to say man up and what not...but maybe it is true. "hurt people, hurt perople." black women have been hurt in the past, do they get over it? i dunno, i'm not a BW. black men get hurt too, in different ways. maybe this is just one manifestation of that.

but here, here are some rocks. kick rocks at these folks to your hearts content.
*shrugs*

Sol_dier said...

urgh.. I don't have rocks for either of them.

I wish them the best in their quest for vanilla sisters,, which part of that do they and you not seem to understand.

It seems like you are and they are bothered by the fact that we don't mind that they don't want us.
We heard you and them. Its cool. go for it. we encourage it. we accept.

Which part of that do you not comprehend?

OneChele said...

We either play nice or don't play at all. And NOT every comment needs a response. Let it stand on it's own merit (or detriment).

Adonis said...

:-)... Good Post sweetheart GIVE ME A MOMENT & I GOT YOU

Adonis said...

See if women actually use their logical brain and carried out their good decision making as you did above... I would be married right now...

Anyway... I love it how black women REFUSE to change their bs ways... They just say we don't want you anyway & complain when I move on to the WW...

Black women want MASCULINE men & will compromise their dignity for one of these men (INDISPUTABLE)
Alot of Black Women Are Materialistic, so a house, car, job is definitely in order
Black women love a smooth talker & a smooth lover... Honesty is not valued...
so I will make the adjustments... unlike most black women (& Gerald) I'm willing to make drastic adjustments to get the women I want...
(Will I respect them...? Probably Not)
(Will They Get A Ring...? GTFOHWTBS...)

I live in reality, not in fantasy.... (#ImDone)

OneChele said...

Enough. You've made your point. Thank you.

BrendaKay said...

Gammas World ~ we're pretty much unofficial right now, but I'm hopeful that OneChele will get around to giving us Mature Folks special status real soon. LoL!

littlemiss said...

There is no right or wrong in dating because right and wrong are only matters of opinion. Opinions vary from person to person. Who cares what Gerald thinks.Everyone has varying preferences. People are so quick to become defensive. Why cant we stop judging people based on their skin color? A woman is a woman whether white, black or yellow. Sheesh, live and let others live. Let the man be happy with whatever floats his boat. Sure his comment may be take offensively by some people but he said what he said and he has his reasoning for his comment. He has a natural right to date whoever he wants and to say whatever he wants.

Just Ang said...

I just want to know where were you when I was living in Tampa, Jake?

You are cute!

Nic said...

But let's not pretend there is an abundance of good black men worth marrying. GTFOHWTBS.

SingLikeSassy said...

Jesus wept.

Adonis said...

Cause he still likes black women, he is just sick of all the bs most of the sistas bring... (that answer is easy)

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