Thursday, December 16, 2010

So then... is there any such thing as an innocent flirtation?


After yesterday's post on "just a kiss," a few follow-up issues popped up. Let's tackle one today - the intriguing question, where is the line between "innocent flirtation" and cheating? I'll admit to being super, duper biased on this issue. One of my exes always seemed to be "inappropriately friendly" with random broads. [Turned out he was inappropriately naked with random broads but that's not this post] Seriously, beyond a hello and a how are you this evening, what's with all the chitter chatter, banter, eyeballin' and banter with strange chicks?  There's "just making conversation" and then there is being receptive to advances. 

Ex-dude and I were at a restaurant and a chick walked past, stopped, did a double take, walked back and struck up a conversation. I sat there with the upraised brow when she looked at me and said, "I just had to stop a say hello." To which I replied, "I'm sure you did." She said, "Oh I'm sorry, are you upset?" Me, "Not unless he gets up and leaves with you instead of me which is highly unlikely." I smiled with all my teeth. She looked from him to me and walked away. He said, "You handled that well." I sent him a look, "I wouldn't have had to if you had shut it down from jump." And there ensued a "discussion."

I will also admit to being hyper-sensitive about phone calls and texts. If you are in a committed relationship, who the heck is calling/texting you at 1:00 am on Saturday night? Maybe with a phone call, I can assume it's some sort of family issue that must be handled. But texts after midnight? Who can give a good reason (non-cocoa-seeking) for that? Do share, I'm dying to know. 

Another in the many excellent dates of my life, I was riding in the passenger seat of a car when dude's phone rang. The woman calling spoke so loudly, I could hear her telling him all the things she wanted to do with him, that evening if only he were free. I'm sitting there like WTF?! I threw a little bit of a tantrum demanding to be taken home immediately.

I also send laser beam side-eyes to men and women on social media platforms. I have watched with pursed lips while folks that I know are in committed relationships get into all manner of hot mess conversations on Twitter and Facebook. What part of the game is that? Sir, you are really having a conversation about superior head game with a group of single women? Where is your wife?! 

Ladies, before you get all smug - some of the sisterhood out here shootin' bad as well. I stumbled across a "Twitter After Dark" conversation between a very married lady and a dude who was straight hollering... hard. Do folks not realize that tweets last forever? That the freakin' Library of Congress is capturing those things for all eternity? Might not want to offer cocoa by the cupful at midnight when you were tweeting about your happy marriage at midday... just sayin'.

In my mind, innocent flirtation should be just that. A casual exchange with no expectation of it going any further then the brief sparkly look and chat. That's why I believe flirtation is for the truly single. Once you are on the path to putting a ring on it, I just think you can be nice but hold back the twinkly "hope to stir your cocoa" vibe. Am I being na├»ve?

BougieLand - where are the lines? At what point does a conversation becoming a borderline betrayal? Is it tone? Context? Intent? Can you cheat with someone you never see (social media)? Can a committed person flirt just for kicks? Anyone want to take a stab at defining "flirting"? Thoughts, comments, insights? The floor is yours.

128 comments:

Angela said...

Michele, I am in complete agreement with you! At the very least, people who really enjoy flirting with any and everyone (whether in a relationship or not) need to find like minded people to be in relationship with.

Michele said...

I have an ex who was a social friggin butterfly and what I called "flirting" he called "just being friendly". Whatever, if it makes me uncomfortable then you need to cease and desist.

Moabmu said...

You're not naive, you give and demand respect (which almost seems to be a lost art form these days). When people allow free radicals into their relationships, it's just a matter of time before one of the persons involved takes it too far. Beyond pleasantries, there's no need for all that "How YOU doin'?" type eye contact, conversation, texting, facebooking, twittering, and body language to be exchanged. In my world a committed relationship is just that - your lingering looks, flirting, sweet talk, touches, kisses, sexing, texting and the like - is all COMMITTED to me, and I reciprocate that. The.End.

OSHH said...

ITA!

05girl said...

If you are in a committed relationship, who the heck is calling/texting you at 1:00 am on Saturday night? <<< maybe you the two are just "cool" like that. I don't see why I have to stop receiving late night calls/texts from friends just because I'm in a relationship.

In my mind, innocent flirtation should be just that. A casual exchange with no expectation of it going any further then the brief sparkly look and chat. That's why I believe flirtation is for the truly single. << Now I really don't understand these two lines. If there is NO expectation of it going further.... than what's the problem ? Now, I think both parties must have that expectation... you can't be leading folks on.

Just_A_Thought1218 said...

There is such a thing as innocent flirting. It usually goes like this: 1. Intro/hello; 2. One or two lines of non-sexual conversation; 3. Outro/goodbye w/o exchange of numbers/names/contact info. It usually lasts 30 s and it usually only happens with people you meet incidentally and will never see again. Once you cross the line to always kee-kee'ing in Jamal's face at the office, or taking lunches w/ Tameka and making people think you are a couple, or even discussing cocoa games (even if talking about it in general, instead of talking about playing with each other), you are in Betrayal-ville and you need to check yourself before you wreck yourself and your relationship.

Personally, I had an ex that was waaaayyy too friendly with women friends and coworkers. Needless to say, he cheated with his women friends and coworkers. I no longer have the fortitude to entertain such foolishness. The moment I get a whiff that you are inappropriately close to other women (and if a disproportionate number of your women friends are exes or people you tried to sleep with), I'm out.

tiffanyinhouston said...

If you are in a committed relationship, who the heck is calling/texting you at 1:00 am on Saturday night? <<< maybe you the two are just "cool" like that. I don't see why I have to stop receiving late night calls/texts from friends just because I'm in a relationship. If you don't see how that could be problematic, then you probably don't need to be in a relationship at that time. It's all good in the hood when you get a late night text or call, right?? So what's your opinion when HE gets those late night texts/calls? You gonna be straight with all that, right?? If you are, then more power to you. Everyone's dymanics are different.

CaliGirlED said...

Well there it is there!!!

CaliGirlED said...

Ok, let's keep it real!

FlirtyNerd said...

In my opinion, flirting is like a bat signal. If you're cooing and giggling and batting your eyelashes, you're telling the recipient that you're interested. Period. There is a difference between that versus flashing a bright smile at the man who held the door open for you, or chatting up a co-worker versus doing tongue tricks (a la Cherry on I'm Gonna Git You Sucka) and long stares at a person.

If your partner is uncomfortable with how you act with the opposite sex, then you need to nip that behavior in the bud. Be advised, however, that there is a fine line between him/her feeling uncomfortable and them being insecure. If your partner says "Honey, I didn't like that extended hug with so-and-so", then that's uncomfortable. If your partner says "Honey, I don't like the way you were in the same air space as so-and-so", then that's insecurity.

As far as the late-night phone calls and texts, that needs to be nipped in the bud too. I understand that person was your friend before the relationship, but that friend needs to respect your relationship. Two of my best friends are men, one is married. I don't text him past 9:00 p.m. because I know he's at home with Wifey at that time. I know I would give the ultra laser beam side eye if I knew my man was getting texts from a random chick at 1:00 a.m. That's not insecurity; that's being smart, observant and definitely not naive. There's nothing that can be accomplished at 1:00 a.m. that can't be accomplished at 9:00 a.m. (emergencies excluded)

Lady4Real said...

"Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." With this being said, I.DO.NOT.FLIRT. If I caught my husband flirting I would have his golden tongue on a platter and give him the same right if I were to do the same. I agree with you BougieCousin, flirting is for the single, the involved or married should only flirt with their partner. There is no such thing as innocent flirting, it is a slippery slope that causes too much shiggity. We are all human and attractions may happen but we are also adults so unlike children we should know how to tame ourselves. I'm Queen of 'shutting ish down", if I think that a friend is getting too friendly I will shut ish down so quick he would think I was the secret service and he was a redneck, with a gun permit, looking at the President too long. I don't play Bush and Katrina games with flirting, I bust in, shut it down and ask no questions. If you are flirting something is not being fulfilled at home and it needs to be addressed.

tiffanyinhouston said...

I was really trying to go the politically correct route to say that I thought that statement was bullshit. Oh well: I'll just say it, that's some bullshit right there.

CaliGirlED said...

I don't think you're being naive, but then maybe that's because I am too. I just don't get cheating! If you want to be with someone, then be with them, if you don't, then don't. I think people make it more complicated than it really is. I also think cheating is more of characteristic flaw than "situational" as people try to use as an excuse. Of course none is perfect and all have a flaw or two, or three (four, five?).

Anywhoo, Webster defines flirting as, verb - 1) To make playfully romantic or sexual overtures. 2) To act so as to attract or provoke. 3) To move abruptly. Noun - 1) One who flirts. 2) An abrupt, jerky movement.

IMHO, there's no such thing as "innocent flirting" because the word itself (flirt) is dynamic, in that it is intended to produce progress....I totally agree with Moabmu's comment below, "In my world a committed relationship is just that - your lingering looks, flirting, sweet talk, touches, kisses, sexing, texting and the like - is all COMMITTED to me..."

CaliGirlED said...

I don't call my married female friends after 10pm (unless it's an emergency)! Respect the marriage, friendship be damned!!!

CaliGirlED said...

"...if I think that a friend is getting too friendly I will shut ish down so quick he would think I was the secret service and he was a redneck, with a gun permit, looking at the President too long. I don't play Bush and Katrina games with flirting, I bust in, shut it down and ask no questions."...This.right.here!!! *dead*

tiffanyinhouston said...

This here particular subject strikes a nerve with me, especially being a newlywed. I am HUGE on boundaries and expectations. When I was single, I was hyperaware in my dealings with married dudes. If I had to call a married man to take of some business, I made sure to speak with his wife when I called. I made sure to always acknowledge a person's spouse if I saw them in the public. It was common practice for me to scan the left hand for a ring or tan line when I was out getting my mingle on because really, I had no conversation for a married man. The best thing he could have done for me was introduce me to a single one. I found that for ME, it kept down confusion and drama. I don't need that in my life.

Social networking is where folks are doing the mostest. Playing these "ask-me-a-question-in-my-inbox" and the silly little numbers game, is just an excuse for folks to get out of pocket. There were some chicks that my husband is FB friends with that were somewhat suspect in terms of their commentary prior to us getting engaged and married but they seem to have cooled their jets now. But I'm not stupid, cause I don't have love for hoes...just like Snoop. I always have my eyes open.

Penny said...

If you are in a committed relationship (married or not) and you receive a text at 1AM, that person is sending a signal that they have no respect for your relationship. Doesn't matter what the text message said; no matter how innocent sounding the message. (If it were a true emergency, such as a car accident, etc. you would have picked up the phone to call.) If you are the person receiving the text, and you respond, then you don't have much respect for your relationship either.

aishao1122 said...

I will confess, I flirt, hell I'll flirt with a lot of people. It's just who i am. A teasing comment hear or there certainly gets the day going.
I'm not cheating, and I don't mingle with those who are obviously in a committed relationship. I don't disrespect anyone least of all myself.
I don't however make it more than it needs to be meaning there is no hinting of this going further than this moment.
As long as numbers aren't exchanged then I don't see why it's an issue. now I've never boldly walked up to a man at a table or someone who is clearly taken and gotten the flirt on. But if we have been introduced and you get that vibe and you and the person can just trade quips and have fun talking?? Then yeah, I go with it, never excluding anyone and certainly never making it seem like hey we might leave together.
i am a flirt and I'm not sorry :P

Just_A_Thought1218 said...

Girl, there are six dudes I had to 86 because of their FB foolishness. It seems the closer their wedding got, the more out of pocket they became. I didn't need any fiancees pissed at me because their man was putting feelers out to every single woman on their friends list trying to see who bit.

C. Chick said...

There is a such thing as innocent flirting (compliments), but it should not involve any prolonged contact. A man making a comment like "Girl, you workin' those boots!" as he carries his a** into the store is an innocent flirtation. A woman saying to a man "You got that 1 blade on sharp, right!?!" is an innocent flirtation. If your mate respects you when it starts feeling "funny" they'll dash. Trust them enough to do so.

A side comment: Lately I've seen a rash of women who try to sterilize their mates from other women. You know... the couple comes into the restaraunt, spot you and all the sudden she stands all up in the mans grill. Starts eyeballing you so much that you feel like you should keep your eyes glued to the ground. Holding his hand so hard that the brotha looks literally handcuffed. Everybody's said it before: "Don't nobody want him!" I just want any women like that to know that you are not stopping nothing, you look crazy and you are prolonging the inevitable (if he's that type of guy). What you gonna do is force him come up with more covert and sly ways of doing his bidding. If he's a dog let him bark, and go find yourself a man instead of stressing out and not trusting every sista you see. Relax, if it's all about you he'll show you and if he doesn't then you know it ain't.

That's all. :)

JaymeC said...

Y'all can play (as Chele calls them) bald-headed barefoot reindeer games if you want to. Let me just say this: Flirting is for the single. Why? Flirting plants a seed. It may be tiny but there it is. The idea of "maybe". Some seeds take next to zero nurturing to grow. If you're in a relationship and particularly a marriage - nothing good comes from outside "maybes". Once you start sending out that vibe (innocent though it seems), you're starting down a slippery slope. But hey, y'all live like you like.

*stomps out of BougieLand slamming door behind her*

GrownAzzMan said...

This right here! Any call after 10:00 needs to involve a hospital or the po-po...IJS

GrownAzzMan said...

When they are trying to determine cause of death it was this--->"...if I think that a friend is getting too friendly I will shut ish down so quick he would think I was the secret service and he was a redneck, with a gun permit, looking at the President too long. I don't play Bush and Katrina games with flirting, I bust in, shut it down and ask no questions."

Carey Jackson said...

You tell 'em Jayme. Just got out of a LTR with guy who had WAY too many maybes hanging around.

Mr. Skyywalker said...

Here's the deal. When I'm talking to females other than the future MrsSkyy, I keep it friendly but in check. Chicks are flagrant. The minute I got engaged, girls came out of woodwork tryna holla. What's that about? Same with her. Her exes appeared out of nowhere trying to make a play. It's like some people see the ring as a challenge. WDDDA, Chele?

suebhoney said...

I will confess too. I am also a flirt. At my favorite watering hole, the regulars are there and quite a few are married. I know this, and I keep it strictly innocent . If a married man is flirting with me, I will flirt back knowing that as a rule "I don't do married", so he can talk all the trash that he wants to and he can buy the bar, but that's all you got comin is trash talking. And if he is flirting and is with someone (yes it does happen) he definitely gets the "stanky side-eye". Have I been in a committed relationship and flirted? Yes (out with the girls, the party is jumpin, and the fella's are definitely up in the place) and that's as far as it went . No numbers exchanged, no impressions that anything additional will be happening afterwards,drank all night for free ( a girl needs her money for shoes-lol ). After the party I went home. In my mind it's all about self-control
Now as for the late night phone calls and texts for couples in committed relationships that is a definite NO-NO unless a family member is bleeding about the head and is calling from the back of the ambulance. And I definitely have ZERO tolerance for "man down/pimp in distress" phone calls and unless you don't want me to accompany you (because I have) you'd better call someone else.

monna said...

I dated a guy who was over the top with his flirtations. His argument was; a brother is just browsing & I’m going home with you. Say what? I also have a girlfriend that says it’s ok to have appetizer, just remember main course is being served at home.

thinklikeRiley said...

Riley iz single. Riley gets his flirt on. But Riley don't play with married folk. If I get a Mrs Riley, Imma flirt with her. Ya flirt to get da number, ya get da number to get da drawers. Ya get da drawers to get da drawers again. Til I want more than drawers, here's a lil sumthin sumthin for BougieLand:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OYj5k3tZLZM

Monica said...

I ain't calling nobody after 9PM except hubby and my mama.

OneChele said...

Exactly!

blackprofessor said...

I only flirt with men that I KNOW are single and available. Everyone else may as well be a priest to me! I don't flirt with married or involved men, too potential for drama and pettiness.

As far as the late night texts/calls/tweets/FB messages, I will tell yall what my mama said - the only thing open after 10 PM is legs!!!

blackprofessor said...

Fist bump to JaymeC!!

OneChele said...

Besides sharing the correct spelling of our names, we are right >here< on this one. Even if a person doesn't think they are being flirtatious, if it's giving me significant pause - why do it?

Just_A_Thought1218 said...

No doubt that happens, as people are trying to get their last shot in. HOWEVER, in a reply to Tiffany in Houston, I've had more experience shutting down dudes who were engaged trying to get that last train to Trifling-ville with whomever they could. People I hadn't heard from in almost five years start sending emails, txts, and FB messages trying to catch up to see if I had any interest. Ninja please. If I never tried to holla when you were unentangled, then best believe I have no interest now.

OneChele said...

And maybe the overall issue is lack of respect now that I think about it.

OneChele said...

Yeah that whole "cool" like dat vibe leaves out your friend's S.O. who is no doubt unamused at having her man chatting with another woman while she is posted up in the bed with him. Gotta look at it from a 360 degree view.

Monna said...

Very much in agreement. I have 2 male friends that I grew up with and whatnot. One of them is married, whenever I call his home, I go through Mrs. (most days I call over the weekend ) and our conversation never last longer than 5 minutes. It boils down to respecting people's relationship period.

Grace said...

I am a flirt but I don't play with it. And late night phone calls? No ma'am.

OneChele said...

Gold star to Just A Thought for nailing the "innocent flirtation" definition: 1. Intro/hello; 2. One or two lines of non-sexual conversation; 3. Outro/goodbye w/o exchange of numbers/names/contact info. It usually lasts 30 s and it usually only happens with people you meet incidentally and will never see again.

OneChele said...

^5 for this entire comment. Folks need to quit playing.

Lady4Real said...

I had to shut down calls after 9 p.m. with my parents, my father and my new mother-in-law had some weird obession with calling us newlyweds at the craziest damn times, 10pm, 12 midnight one time it was 2a.m. I respectfully reminded them that we are newlyweds and once the kiddies got to bed, mom and dad like to play, so unless someone is dead or dieing stop calling. Neither one of us has anyone calling or texting us off the late night, all our friends know better and no exes have our numbers so we don't even have to worry about that one.

OneChele said...

Thank you BougieCuz for proving that no tolerance for shiggity runs in the DNA. This fam don't get down like dat.

OneChele said...

I actually specifically told one guy, if you see someone else you want to be with... walk away. No harm, no foul. But if I find out about it later?! As for "situational" cheating - hmpfh - we could do a whole BougieLand theme week on that one.

Jasmin said...

Agreed (on the comment and the spelling of my middle name). :-)

KAPSpecial said...

OneChele I’m with you 100%. I’m very careful about what I do and say around married men and men that are in relationships. They can do whatever they want, but they won’t be doing it with me. I respect boundaries and believe in only opening doors that I’m considering walking through. And that’s what a flirtation is – an opening. I’m not trying to be anyone’s mistress or side-piece so I conduct MYSELF accordingly. If you’re in a committed relationship I do not think it is wise to open up that door. Today it was a cute smile, 3 weeks later it is an exchange of cute quips, 4 weeks after that an invite to a party that you conveniently attend without your S.O., 2 weeks after that a coffee meeting and 2 weeks after that swapping slob at the bistro. Sometimes it doesn’t take all that time and other times you may “innocently” flirt for years and then one day the dynamics change and something inappropriate goes down. Then you find yourself sounding like Steve Urkel, “Uh oh, did I do that?!?!” Umm, yes you most certainly did.

I have a married friend who likes go to the club to flirt and “see if he still got it.” His thought is that it’s innocent, he always goes home and his wife receives the benefit of all his flirtation (i.e. cocoa). My concern is that one time he might have one drink too many, find himself flirting with an attractive woman with some skripper moves and the situation pulls waaaayyyyy out of the Innocent Flirtation Station. Not cool. Plus with cell phones everyone is paparazzi. If he finds himself in a compromising situation and his wife’s friend or worse her frienemy just happens to see him in that moment and texts a picture to his wife or puts it on Facebook, that’s huge drama for no reason. In a relationship, just say no to flirting.

Lady4Real said...

I sooo totally agree with you!!! i call flag on the play, my nose says it smells something, cue the woman with the bullshiggity horn and i now offically call......BULLSHIGGITY!!!

OneChele said...

Facebook and Twitter gonna get folks cut and divorced, I swear. As for keeping your eyes open, there's an old school Bible reference for that - keep your lamps trimmed and burning... Amen.

OneChele said...

This right here.

OneChele said...

I'm strolling through Sam's the other day. Dude in frozen food aisle asked me if they moved the breakfast sausage. I said yes they did, it was over by deli meats now. Out of nowhere, sister girl rolls up and asked me what I said to her husband. I said, "Um - Deli meats?" She sent me the evil eye, grabbed his arm and yanked him away. Good Lawd! Is it that serious?

OneChele said...

Kudos for the Urkel reference and your married friend is skating on thin, thin ice.

OneChele said...

People have become habitual line steppers. They do NOT respect boundaries at all.

OneChele said...

LOL - not man down/pimp in distress!

OneChele said...

You got my pressure up with this one! That "I'm going home with you" line is the MOST RATCHET. So, you can act any old kinda way all night but because you're so kind as to accompany me home, I'm supposed to be okay with it?! No sir. As a matter of fact, Hell No Sir. (Okay, you may have triggered a memory)

OneChele said...

Only Riley would post an RKelly vid in BougieLand.

OneChele said...

BougieDad had a twist "Legs and Bail Bondsmen"

VirtuousKween said...

I totally agree. By flirting, you're just setting yourself up. If you know that the other person is married or in a relationship or vice versa, be nice and keep it moving. That's just trouble waiting to happen!

tiffanyinhouston said...

Word to JaymeC! In our marriage counseling our pastor (and my uncle) told us to guard our marriage. His reasoning is that if you show that you don't respect your marriage vows, why should any one else??? Flirt with your spouse or S/O!!

And I need for married people to stop acting single. If you wanted to be single then you shoulda never got your ass married!

*rant over*

Jasmin said...

As someone who smiles pretty much all the time (I want my parents to get their money's worth for those braces I had to wear in 5th grade--yes, before they were cool), I've found that lots of guys take a smile as an invitation for more, so I had to learn Bougie ways of shutting it down. Point being, we all have personality traits that are open to interpretation, but you can only get misinterpreted so many times before you step up and take control of the situation. Those who don't, don't want to.

Committed relationship + flirting is just a recipe for disaster. It seems like people like to use their relationship status as a shield from criticism--"It doesn't mean anything, I'm married!"--but the ring or the title means nothing if your eyes, lips and body language are saying something else.

C. Chick said...

Haha! I see it like it was me a half an hour ago. "He's mine!", walking away, all in a huff. Yes ma'am, it is that serious to some. I don't get it. It's unhealthy to be running around like Otis from Martin trying to keep tabs on a man.

KAPSpecial said...

I agree. Most of my guy friends are married and we're tight. Their wives know me. One refers to me as being like her sister. But guess what? I don't call my guy friends after 9:45pm cause we don't even need to start conversation that will take us into the 10 o'clok hour. I don't play games. I've known of single women who have let things get too far with taken men, women who I wouldn't have EVER believed would have been a mistress. So I know ain't none of us above falling into a bad situation so I avoid those situations like the plague.

William Martin said...

I used to be a serial flirter. Don't judge. I'm young, single, and good to look at (modest too). But there was this nurse on staff who took my "How you doin' today, pretty lady" (I didn't say my game was tight) and decided I was her man. Ran all over telling everyone I was her man. Called her family told them she met the man she was going to marry. It was borderline stalker. I was saved by the fact that she got fired and ended up moving away. But it gave me pause. Maybe I don't have to flirt with everybody.

And once there's a S.O. I'll dial back the smile and sparkle.

p.s. I turn off the cell at 10:00pm when I'm not on call. If it's an emergency, call me on the house phone.

Lady4Real said...

People choose to allow this shiggity to go on on their social networking pages. Like I said earlier, I am Queen of shutting ish down, so, there are no 'inbox me' games, number games or sly remarks on any of my social network pages. All day, everyday I am married, there is no reason for me to entertain anything that resembles disrespect to my husband or our marriage. If you wouldn't say it to me in front of him, if I can't repeat it to him, or if I would get mad that a female said it to him then it need not be said or done. People need to own it. Shut ish down or go do ya dirt, but stop playing games.

taut_7 said...

i'm flirtatious by nature. when i'm in a relationship i'll dial it back. i know i won't flirt with women who are in a relationship [anymore i think]. i do that you can flirt innocently but there has to be a line drawn and the respect factor should always remain.

Lady4Real said...

You are oh so very welcome. The Bougie don't do shiggity and the blood in my veins don't have fool in it either.

OneChele said...

Thank you sir.

Sarah said...

I'm glad it isn't just me with the irritation about late night phone calls. The last boyfriend used to get phone calls late into the night from his friends and his sisters. They'd call to chat or in the case of his friends to ask for rides (!) On more than one occasion, he told me that he'd said he would give somebody a ride and had forgotten. He wanted to go at 11 pm and give them a ride and then come back. I said he was welcome to go, but he had to return back to his own apartment. And then I got labeled as some kind of control freak. Too bad there wasn't a Bougieland back then to consult. All I feel these days about that relationship is RELIEF that it is over.

soo-bee said...

First time commenting but this post made me speak up. I don't believe there is such a thing as innocent flirting. All flirting should stop once you're in a relationship. I def agree with the commenter who said it all has to do with respect both for your partner and the relationship. Some behaviours (flirting etc.) need to change when you get into a relationship.

sol_dier said...

I am friendly with people. I don't promise what I can't deliver. I am single, I don't do married folk.

Whilst at Uni, I was friends with a married dude in an open marriage which he revealed to me whilst i was reclined in his arms on the steps of a museum on a cool summer night. O_O. I think I froze for a few seconds, before removing myself from his arms.
Only for him to say: 'its okay, I told my wife about you, shes looking forward to meeting you!'.

Dude is a preacher now. O_O

sol_dier said...

I think too many people were left to their own devices growing up, so those boundaries are simply not there. You can really tell a lot about people from what they allow their friends to do and get away with.

rochee said...

I personally feel that flirting while in a relationship is an ABSOLUTE NO-NO! Why do it? What is the point? I personally think a whole lot of shennanigans could and would have been prevented if people didn't engage in "innocent flirtation". And the one thing I can't stand is when someone in a relationship doesn't SHUT DOWN any advance. I don't believe in ambiguity, even if the person has no chance. Don't laugh or giggle or say some completely meaningless nonsense that doesn't let the other person know that you are not interested. Anything short of "I am not interested because I am in a commited relationship", to me gives people too much wiggle room. But I think a lot of people don't shut the flirtation down, even if they aren't interested, because they like the attention and it feeds their egos...again...dangerous. If you don't tell that person NO outright, they will keep trying.

David Chase said...

On the flip though - I was waiting in line at Starbuck's and asked this woman in front of me if she had tried the new Caramel Brulee flavor. She whipped around and said loudly, "Excuse me! I have a man!" Because I've been spending so much time in BougieLand, I did not snap back, "Woman, don't nobody WANT YOU! Brother just trying to up his coffee game!" No I did not. Instead I said, "I'm sorry, I was just curious about the flavor. Sorry if you took it the wrong way." She had the decency to look embarrassed.

Sometimes, it's not flirting. It's just a conversation.

OneChele said...

Whoa.

OneChele said...

Welcome out of Lurkerville.

monna said...

Sad to report that I stayed in that relationship longer than I needed to.

Monna said...

I say if you have an emergency call 911. Tank or Joe, would want us to believe otherwise.

Cue Emergency by both artists.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xne4rHjL0k
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9ly1A5PjMs

tiffanyinhouston said...

Well someone obviously didn't take their meds that day, did they??

D.K. said...

I should have known that the opportunity to share this tale would come along here in Bougie land.
A close friend/coworker of my bro-inlaw decided some time ago to send my husband "hello" texts where she referred to him as "her Marcus". I intercepted one of those texts and decided to play along. (yes that does take me a step closer to ghetto than bougie, forgive me) After she shares all the ways she wants to get to know him better, I shut her down and did all I could to avoid a case when I confronted hubby. He proceeded to explain that they never talked like that before and she is just friendly, whatever, her number betta not show up on the cell phone bill I pay again.
I informed Bougie Sis-inlaw, I thought she should know how her husband's friends act.

Now we jump to 6am on Black Friday in Sears... Bougie Sis-inlaw and I are waiting for our husbands to finish buying electronics when a female comes over to her and asks where is Bro- inlaw, we point him out. She says "Oh wow his brother is here too" and proceeds in their direction. (side eye)
As soon as she is up the aisle Sis-inlaw tells me that ole girl is Miss Text Alot.
I made my way over to the three of them and introduced myself. Of course hubby looked like a deer caught in headlights and she looked confused, but she quickly walked away.
Hubby says I was wrong to come over because he didn't do anything, Bougie Sis-inlaw thinks he was lucky that was all I did. I tend to agree with Sis-inlaw.
The occasional 30second flirt happens, but when you let it escalate into more than that somebody wants something hot-n-steamy no matter how friendly they seem.
Chele sorry it was so long.

BlackButterfly said...

I have boundaries and expectations in a relationship. Flirting is an interview for retainer because you are trying to discern who you are dealing with when you do it. If are married or are SO's then flirting with others is a "no-no"!

Just_A_Thought1218 said...

LOL true. Homegirl was wrong, but I have overreacted in a more dignified fashion (I said not interested" at regular volume) because sometimes, you just get sick of being Bambi in a sea of trigger happy hunters.

Anywho, the caramel brulee flavor is ok. I like teh regular caramel latte better. Not as cloyingnly sweet.

sol_dier said...

sorry.. but something ain't right.
I don't need to shut things down. If the person I am with does not know to shut things down, then I simply can't be with them.
icant.com with all that. Recognise my value and set boundaries, don't wait for me to tell you or act.
No ma'am. I'd be ghost.

KAPSpecial said...

Yeah she was tripping. Cause unless you were sucking your teeth, grabbing your crotch and doing the head-to-toe look, she completely overreacted. I commend your restraint. Hopefully she shared the "incident" with her sane friends and they advised her that she jumped the gun with her response. OR maybe she once cheated on said man with a dude she met at a Starbucks, promised not to let that happen again and homegirl ain't taking NO chances. ;)

D.K. said...

Trust me .. he has been informed that my devotion to the vows we made is the only reason patience is involved.
I never had any reason to question him while we were dating, engaged, or for the first 4yrs of our marriage until this situation. So I'm looking at it as a stumble on his behalf, but he better not fall down because the good Lord will let him get up without me.

AppleBerryMIA said...

Nothing wrong with double-checking what scandalous-ass females have going on around your man. Sometimes just standing there is all they need to know to fall back.

jorgemateo said...

Not that I'm trying to justify anything but... I work as a graphic designer and I get e-mails and texts from different people in different area codes all times of the night. I do try and be respectful and explain before I text/e-mail back to address any types of issues...

In a nutshell, I think flirting is OK provided you can say the same types of things in front of your mate...

Bethany Showell said...

Flirting is never innocent. Too big of a gray area. Even if YOU don't mean anything by it, the other person can take that and run. That being said, I don't care if the dude I'm with flirts. That's just never bothered me. As far as late calls and texting - another gray area. If you're insomniac like me you have certain insomniac friends who will call and text at less than normal hours. Had a guy friend who was a "nurse" and a "DJ" who would get calls and texts at late hours but it was usually the bike club or his hoodrat cousin needing bail.

I Am Me said...

And a respectfully bougie side-eye to all the "flirty" females on here. Ladies the same way you are staring down your men for putting the vibe out there, right back atcha. We know the nature of a man, if you are smiling and flirting he thinks he has a shot. Period.

Pure Choco said...

you can say the same types of things in front of your mate... This is a great measuring stick!

Bethany Showell said...

Well alrighty then...

rozb said...

Innocent flirting is like innocent shoplifting. So what you put it in your pocket? As long as you don't walk out the door, right?

Eventually there may be that one time where you think nobody is looking and you can get away with it. But nope - you get caught, get hemmed up, and all the embarrassment and humiliation is not worth everything you lose from this act.

If you are single and unattached, nothing wrong with a little flirting. However, be careful of how far you take things, and who the signal is going out to. Be sensible, and understand the difference in appreciating the fact that others find you attractive, and seeing how far you can go without being pulled into something you really didn't want. Smiling back is one thing, but sticking your tongue out and running it over your lips takes it to a whole 'nother level.

If you are attached, flirt with your S.O. - it does not make sense to me when you have something at home and you would rather throw the fishing line out to see if your bait is still good.

rozb said...

D.K. - you did excellent! And make sure you check in on the regular!

brownstocking said...

why they gotta be hoes?

Pure Choco said...

Sorry but I believe that is the proper term for some of the no-moral, out-to-get-a-man-even-if-he-is-somebody's-husband thirsty chicks out here. Women we have love for, hoes - not so much.

Steve said...

So... flirting is a gateway drug too?

Annette Evans said...

Standards are at an all time low........

tiffanyinhouston said...

Thank you Pure Choco, you said it better than I could. No other explanation needed.

Sarah said...

It's a funny picture you paint although it probably wasn't funny at the time. Methinks she was feeling guilty about some other situation and dumped it on you.

sol_dier said...

good for you :)

sol_dier said...

we do similar work. But one thing I learned is this being available at all ours of the day doesn't necessarily make people value you or your work ethic. take for granted ... oh yes. value? I dunno.

Set standards and allow them to miss you sometimes

sol_dier said...

lol
'ticking your tongue out and running it over your lips takes it to a whole nother level'
lol.. yep thats called offering it on a plate.Nothing wrong with that, as long as u know thats the suggestion.

jorgemateo said...

that has always worked for me...

jorgemateo said...

Agreed...

GrownAzzMan said...

So is it telling too much that I used to have that song as my ring tone? Jus axin'...

GrownAzzMan said...

OK, my like button is broken. *fist bump*

GammasWorld said...

If you can't say it or do it in front of your partner, then it's probably too much. #justsayin

OneChele said...

It's DISQUS glitch, it's only registering about one of every three likes. Maybe I should request a "Fist Bump" button? ;-)

Reecie said...

when I had these issues thats exactly what angered me the most---its always about respect to me.

OneChele said...

So you should literally be able to feel the side-eye I'm sending you with the L.O.V.E. from Texas to Cali.

CaliGirlED said...

Amen!!!

CaliGirlED said...

Exactly! Hell the damn definition of the word says to attract or provoke. Hello people!!!

CaliGirlED said...

Yes! LOL

CaliGirlED said...

Agreed!...It was just lunch/a drink/a meeting in the park/a movie/dinner/etc. etc. etc. Why if he/she is married or involved with someone? No need to even spend that kind of time! Never underestimate the power of feelings and where they can lead you. That's human nature!

CaliGirlED said...

One drink too many, attractive woman/man, "skripper" moves + opportunity = DEADLY combination!

CaliGirlED said...

But you were single, right? Imagine being in a relationship, flirting with someone else and then finding out that they are crazy/psycho/51-50. People out here taking chances! SMH

CaliGirlED said...

What the???

CaliGirlED said...

Can we say 51-50?!! Kudos for not saying what you SHOULD have said, "Woman, don't nobody WANT YOU! Brother just trying to up his coffee game!"...But we know if this story had been told by Riley, well let's just say no kudos necessary. LOL

CaliGirlED said...

"Innocent flirting is like innocent shoplifting. So what you put it in your pocket? As long as you don't walk out the door, right?" This.right.here!...I wasn't really going to take it!

CaliGirlED said...

A whole week? I don't know if my blood pressure can handle that. LOL

Page Bartlett said...

You aren't naive, you're just not putting up with shiggity. Too many people do.

CorettaJG said...

Agreed.

Anjelt27 said...

I'm kind of torn on this, I believe ou can look but don't touch. Although I think that if you're married, engaged, in a committed relationship then no there shouldn't be any flirting, texting or sexting which seems to be the thing now-a-days. I think that if you are "innocently" flirting then that's what it should be no expectations you go home, I go home to mine. Nothing more!

Tonda Williams said...

My philosophy is very simple and clarified BEFORE I agree to a committed relationship. I will NEVER, step to another woman about my man and if another woman EVER steps to me about my man, rest assured that she instantly becomes HIS problem. It is HIS job to ensure that every woman outside this relationship respects ME and it is MY job to ensure that every man outside this relationship respects HIM.

Consequences of failing this simple task? Immediate TERMINATION!

There is NOTHING gray about it....People play too much...*hmpf*

C Nelson said...

You know, there's a funny thing about FaceBook. One of my better friends is an attorney, and it is amazing how much easier divorce cases are becoming, because your ex's attorney? Is allowed to friend you on FaceBook as long as they don't pretend to be someone else. All your business that you put on there? Is admissible in court when it comes time to prove infidelity and talk about the alimony and custody. So all those "innocent flirtations" ... they come back to bite you in more ways than just the obvious, if you let them go too far. People just don't know, they really don't.

FlirtyNerd said...

*blink blink*

Only the Tall said...

Just because you're married to someone does not mean that you own them. As long as there are men and women on this earth there will be flirtation, healthy or otherwise. The best that you can do is to start choosing men or women who love you and respect you enough to not be disrespectful towards you and your relationship. We all flirt, it's healthy, it's human! My God, once somebody "puts a ring on it" (so tired of that expression) that's it, game over? I don't think so. We flirt at work, at the supermarket, everywhere. Now what you call flirting in this post I call being blatantly disrespectful. That wasn't flirting, that was him telling and showing you what he thought of your relationship. A "discussion" ensued? I would've gotten up, placed the "lady" in my seat, and called a cab and pressed delete and Block on the cell, but that's just me. I make clean breaks = no drama.

Only the Tall said...

Amen! You said it all right here! Women who "sterilize their mates from other women" just look foolish, desperate and pitiful. People do what they want to do. Clutching your man extra hard is not going to make him stick to you more, ok?

Only the Tall said...

How about turning your phone off? People kill me acting as if they're Richard Branson with their cell phones. Newsflash, you are not that important. If there's an emergency, the person will call your land line. If you don't have a land line then you have more problems than a text message in the middle of the night. Hey, if someone died, they'll still be dead in the morning. Trust me on this.

Only the Tall said...

and zippers

Only the Tall said...

You should get an award for your restraint. Young man continue to keep yourself classy. LOL!

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