Tuesday, November 23, 2010

Thirsty is the new black? Are folks just too desperate?


In yesterday's innocent post about Scrabble, we talked about a girlfriend of mine (we'll call her Jackie) who was anxious for all of us to meet Her New Man. He did not impress.

But many readers felt I smoothed over another (perhaps bigger) issue. What did Jackie see in HNM and why did she feel the need for her crew's opinion?  She's attractive and accomplished  but still feels the need to 1) Seek out approval for her choices and 2) Ego Stroke a dude for cocoa. Okay, he was attractive to look at and according to him, quite the upwardly mobile professional. 

I had people emailing, tweeting and texting me in outrage over Jackie. So when she called me today to chat, I took the opportunity to ask, "What's the deal with HNM?"

She said, "Yes, I've heard from all of you guys now, you didn't like him. You just didn't see him in his best light. He's really smart and fun. He adores me."

Reading between the lines I asked (delicately) about his cocoa game thinking that must be the reason she is putting up with the other stuff. Apparently he is stirring it the right way. [BnB does not endorse the staying with folks just for cocoa's sake. Kthxbi. ~The Management] "But Jackie, he's kind of possessive and controlling. That worries me a little."

"He's just a strong personality."

"So strong that you wanted me to throw a Scrabble game? You felt the need to applaud three and four letter words?"

"He's at his best when you pump him up a little. A man wants to feel like his woman is in his corner."

"No doubt, but it didn't seem like that was what was going on there."

"I just want him to feel cherished around me. All the time."

Sounded exhausting to me. "Jackie, come on now. That doesn't even sound like you."

"You don't understand, you have hot and cold running men on tap."

**crickets** Color Chele unamused. "That is categorically untrue. And more than a little offensive. And did I mention UNTRUE?" Six deep breaths later, "AND... not the point. I don't think you (or any woman) needs to be with a man that makes her change who she is at the core."

"He loves me for me." Jackie said.

"He loves you? All the time or just when you do and say and act like he likes?"

"You don't know him like I do."

Silently, I think 'Thank God for that' but I said, "Admittedly. So make me understand. Really. If you feel this strongly, maybe I'm missing something."

"He may have his flaws but he's here for me. He's really, really into me."

"Yeah, I still don't get it."

We went round and a round a few more times before she got uberdefensive. She angrily said that she loved him and he loved her and we just couldn't "get to their level" before she hustled off the phone.

Okay then. For me that told me everything I needed to know. First of all, she's only known HNM for a little over a month - she loves him? He loves her? For real tho? From the outside looking in, she is successful, attractive and vibrant. From a little closer in, she's a little needy, insecure and lonely. Not necessarily huge flaws but rolled into this scenario, it just equals thirsty. 

To me it appears that she has decided that old boy is the 3:10 to Yuma (otherwise known as the last train outta Dodge) and she is determined to be on it.  Come hell or high water. In the just under four hour period I spent with him, dude showed ten out of the twenty characteristics of a psychopath but she is determined that he is The One.

This depresses me on a number of levels. I vividly recall her last relationship. Absolutely great guy. Bright, funny, respectful, easy going, low drama, low maintenance - we all really liked him (which is why I suspect she wanted to see what we thought about this one).  It lasted three years until she bailed with much drama because she was tired of waiting on the ring. (Never mind that he planned to ask her later that year and she didn't know. She gave him a today or never ultimatum and that was that.) Since that break-up, she's been on a quest to get somebody (dare I say anybody?) to put a ring on it.

That, my friends, is the definition of thirsty. To be so parched for the relationship that leads to the ring that you put up with all manner of shiggity. Including waving pom-poms when your man spells a word, orchestrating lame dinner parties and praying his mood stays up long enough for a chocolate swirl. Thirsty. 

Lest you think I'm only bashing the girls, there are plenty of thirsty dudes out there as well - I just didn't encounter them over the weekend. They will no doubt have their moment in sun here on BougieLand sooner rather than later. But for today, let me ask you this - if Jackie is your friend, what do you say? And thoughts, comments, prayers? The floor is yours...

185 comments:

Donell Creech said...

you've led that thirsty horse down to the shores of lake minnetonka, again and again. a slow love death by dehydration appears to be her mission.

Shondriette D Kelley said...

I don't think there is anything you can say to or do for Jackie right now. She's made a decision to "love" HNM so let her. Pray that she comes to her senses but other than that stand silent. My best guess is that this romance will be short-lived so you won't have to hold your tongue for long.

MidWestDominicana said...

Wowwww *Flava Flav voice*
Been there. My ex-BFF went through nearly the exact same lame game. After breaking up with the love of her life (and she was his, too...still is), she went through a string of losers. Ended up meeting this guy, at least 5 years her junior, no aim, no ambition, no nothing (except rich parents), moved him in with her after two weeks, married him after about 5 months and is now divorced and on her way to marriage #2.
I took the opportunity to ask her why she was marrying #1 and she gave the same sob story about how much they love each other, yadda, yadda, yadda (weed smoking, model car building, no job having, baseball playing little boy). I told her that I knew better and she finally admitted to "settling" but it was because she was the age she was and needed to be married or it'd never happen (26 -_- really?!) I told her that I loved her like my own blood, but I couldn't stand by and support such a sham.
She chucked up the deuces and that was that. She went through an abusive and unfulfilling marriage that lasted less time than a football game, lost an amazing friend and a year of her life that she can never get back and all for what? Being thirsty and for the wrong drink.

Thirsty definitely ain't cute, boo.

rozb said...

Props for Purple Rain reference.

Leon X said...

That conversation you had with Jackie sounds like a high schooler trying to convince you that her and her boyfriend are in love.

Shondriette D Kelley said...

That entire story is epically sad for so many reasons and for so many people. I'm sorry for you, your ex-BFF and her ex-boyfriend.

Just_A_Thought1218 said...

Nada. Nien. Zero. Nothing. To get unbougie for a minute, not a muthafrackin thang. You let this disaster run its course and come around to comfort her after it has gone to hades in a handbag. And to be on the watch if she starts showing more obvious signs of being abused.

I was Jackie once upon a time, and frankly there wasn't much people could say to dissuade me from the path of destruction. When you're sitting in the desert, the last thing you want to hear from people in a fresh water oasis is 'wait, stop, slow down, it'll come.' Um, not necessarily and certainly not right now. I was just as defensive when all the happily boo'd up people [or single women who had a swarms of Ideal Black Men interested in them] told me to wait. But until you go through the drama and headache that they were trying to help you avoid, you can't see the wisdom they are dispensing.

Kandra said...

I think we have all had at least one Jackie in our lives. You can't say anything to anyone that is not in a place to hear it. She is really thirsty and unless you are in a position to quench it she isn't going to hear it. I don't know what it is about successful women but they always seem to "build" a loser into a winner. All they end up with is time wasted and opportunities missed because no one likes their triflin significant other. Lets all pray for the Jackies in the world to realize they are so much better than that.

Leressa said...

Unfortunately, there is nothing you can say or do at this point. She has drawn the proverbial line in the sand and she is standing her ground. To her , HNM is the best thing since sliced bread and anything you say bad about him, any doubts that you have about the state of their union will be met with a defensive attitude and she may even think you are hate'n on her and her new found boobookins. You can only back up and allow her to go through what is sure to be a hot mess of a relationship and be there to help her pick up the pieces when it all falls apart.

Jubilance said...

Jackie makes me weep, like seriously. She's setting herself up for a world of trouble.

First, the relationship she left with the good guy all cause she didn't get the ring on her timetable? 0_o

And now she's putting up with a man who I guarantee is a potential/future abuser all so she can have a man & (maybe) say she's finally married? 0_o

Marriage is not the end-all/be-all that so many women think it is. Your life doesn't begin when a man asks you to be his wife. You are still wonderful & amazing even if you are single. As my friend used to tell me "You aren't dead, you're just single". Being single is not a bad thing. I'd much rather be single than in Jackie's situation.

I think you should let her know that you'll always be there for her...cause one day (hopefully) she'll wake up & realize that the new guy is pure wackness & she's gonna need the support of family & friends to get her through it.

rozb said...

We beat up on "Jackie" a lot yesterday, and we clowned Scrabble Dude thoroughly. But all jokes aside, her pendulum is swinging wildly to the other side. She saw her mistakes, perceived and real and is determined to not let another one go. She is doing what a lot of us have done - try what we think is the opposite to see if that works. She was with a smart, nice, stable guy who may have been moving just a little too slow for her taste at the time, so she decides to go for the exact opposite - or what she thinks is the exact opposite.

I would ask my friend what would she do if she had to give me a reality check on a guy. Then I would let her know that although I can't understand her need to tolerate shiggity for some bone time, and it is a lonely world out there, I will be there for her. Not in her business, but if he starts pulling out the other 10 signs of a psychopath, she can always call me with an emergency code word or a signal to let me know to call the po-po or something. However, I will be staying away. I'll even extend invites to her and HNM - if he establishes a pattern of being a jack of all asses she might see for herself and get tired of being embarrassed and making excuses for him.

Jackie is in lust with HNM right now, and no amount of logic or common sense is going to be able to compete with powerful, intoxicating, hot, delicious, and strong cocoa. No ma'am it won't. It will be up to her to get tired of him to the point she can't stand the temper tantrums or the random acts of stupidity. And I hope and pray that she has no tolerance for physical and emotional abuse. She is trying to do the most with the least, and God Bless her for it, but this relationship she's driving right now is heading for a giant-assed brick wall.

HNM needs therapy and perhaps Jesus, and not necessarily in that order.

Only the Tall said...

This is so sad. In six months time, she'll be accidentally bumping into doors, if you know what I mean. This is classic and classically tragic. He smells a weak chick and she's looking for someone to save her. Game over.

michaeldavis said...

she jumped in the water but just like the movie, that ain't Lake Minnetonka

MidWestDominicana said...

Thanks for the sympathy. I continue to pray for her and her happiness. Hope that she gets unthirsty and can appreciate what she has still waiting for her.

PrettyP said...

This is an unfortunate situation because Jackie's primary concern is how much NHM likes her. She has seemingly little to no consideration of whether she actually likes him (for HIM and not because he is a man who is into her). This reeks of desperation and settling. Jackie should definitely aim higher.

Any chance she and the previous beau can get back together? It's so sad that she ended a great relationship behind her "put a ring on it" timeline. :-(

Brneyed1 said...

Speaking as someone who stayed in a relationship looong after it's expiration date, you can't wake her up. She'll have to wake up on her own. All you can do is voice your concern, tell her that you are there for her if she needs you, and really BE there if she does (I had some "friends" who broke camp when I needed them most).

Scrabble Dude is filling a void (real or perceived) in her life right now. Hopefully she'll realize that she was already whole without him.

BrendaKay said...

At risk of being particularly harsh at "Jackie" she is what I lovingly call an "Approval Suck". And when a person is in that frame of mind, they are beyond being just thirsty, they are desperate for love, companionship and acceptance. As "Only the Tall" mentioned, I pray that Jackie doesn't suddenly start bumping into doors, because that is generally the next step on the Approval Suck's ladder heading downwards.

SingLikeSassy said...

I realize I'm just reading your take on it but something about this and yesterday's post makes me scared for Jackie. I'll just pray for her.

Monica said...

Let go and Let God. She doesn't want to get it. For everything you point out, Jackie has a defense. She is bent on making this thing work By Any Means Necessary. That shook up, shook down, strung out, and stupid phase she's calling love is infatuation and it is fleeting.

maureen palmer said...

Jackie darling, you are doing this all wrong. Do not dim your light for the sake of having a man. I strongly believe that even in our lowest momenet we have to fight to maintain our dignity/ the very core of you has to be intact. If this brother can't recognize you worth, I say let it go. Because a lot of pain is about to ensue. Safe future therapist money for a trip to Spain.

JaymeC said...

Well, you don't need an advanced degree in Relationship Psychology to read through this one. She went all in on the last one, gambled and lost so now she's in a situation (suck as it is) that she thinks she can control. Unfortunately for her, she picked a potential dangerous guy to be in this relationship with her. IMHO, she should run (far, fast and free) back to the last dude and plead for forgiveness.

Oh and I lest I forget - I rebuke you for "3:10 to Yuma" - you are SO wrong for that.

OSHH said...

WOW. She is doing the most for someone she barely even knows, and refuses to see in reality lighting. Like I said yesterday you should never have to diminish self for anyone, that right there is a big red flag, let alone this dude's psycho tendencies.
Wake up Jackie!!!

Bigandbeautiful2644 said...

Hello,

I am a longtime lurker, and yesterday's post plus today's is just too much for me. As a young black woman about to graduate with my bachelor's in English I too am aware of the drastic shortage of appropriate men. In Montgomery, Alabama just encountering a man with a bachelor's and gainful employment is a long shot. However, I would never sacrifice my intelligence or confidence for the sake of another. Obviously, HNM has issues and her coddling him or continually attempting to boost his ego will prove tiring and ineffective. If Jackie is all that you say she is Chele( and I'm sure she is), she will realize this. Hopefully, sooner than later. Otherwise, I fear she may become yet another blackwoman who settles instead of waiting for her true match. I am 24, about to take the LSAT, and know that my odds of finding a man with comparable education and intellect are limited; however, I REFUSE to spend life with a mental midget.

Mr. Skyywalker said...

HOLD UP! She's only known this guy a month and he's already playing "hold the cocoa" games? She's already defensive and edgy about him? No. Cut-n-run. CUT-N-RUN!

rozb said...

She should take off and run like Forrest Gump after the leg braces snapped off.

Michele said...

Jackie will figure it out or she'll spend the rest of her days miserable. "He's really into me" can't be a reason for forgetting who you are. Because, guess what? He's not seeing who you really are because you're walking around like a Stepford Wife. I hope she comes to her senses sooner rather than later.

diamond life said...

My thought exactly - this is a grown woman?!

diamond life said...

To answer your title question - YES! Folks are too damn thirsty. I will settle into my chaise lounge with six cats, a Snuggie, knitting needles and a Matlock NeverEnding marathon before I put myself in a situation like this!

Natasha said...

*DEAD* at the Forrest Gump reference, but she should RUN JACKIE RUN...

Veronica Miller said...

MASSIVE side-eye to 26.

Shut. The. %&$&. Up.

Penny said...

I think Jackie is doing what many of us do-looking at the lives of other people, and assuming the other people have the better life. (Example-her comment about you having "hot and and cold men running on tap.") Since other people must have better lives, she had decided to change tactics in order to get what other people have-which she perceives as better than what she has. Not to mention she is probably still kicking herself like crazy about running off "No Drama Guy." (By the way, where is he? Is it really too late?)

You can only hope that Jackie gets a clue quickly (before HNM does something violent) and realizes that: 1) desperation is not becoming; 2) other people don't always have the life that you think they have; 3) there are lots of things worse than being alone-being with a crazy, controlling person is one of those things. Until she gets it, she is going to continue with the "We Shall Not Be Moved" stance, and nothing and no one will be able to move her.

OneChele said...

Yep, I think I said all I can say at this point.

OneChele said...

My thoughts exactly. Add 10 years on there and then you can start whispering about that nonsense. Le Boo!

OneChele said...

I would go back as far as junior high.

OneChele said...

Excellent comment. But for the record Bougienistas, I do NOT have a swarm of Ideal Black Men interested in me... that I'm aware of. Is there a colony of IBMs somewhere? I would like to go visit. ;-)

MidWestDominicana said...

Yo, that's what I'm saying!

GrownAzzMan said...

If Jackie was my friend or my sister or heaven forbid my daughter I would ask the questions you asked and say the things you said. The problem is when one is overwhelmed by thirst they don't hear or see. Not much more you can do but stand by for the great awakening (it will come) and hope it comes sooner then later without her having to pay too high a dignity price. SMH

Sol_dier said...

hee hee ..
you have opened the floodgates now... be careful what you wish for :P

GrownAzzMan said...

Jackie sounds like she is stubborn and the more folks try to pull her coat the more she may dig in her heels.

blackprofessor said...

Sigh! She is being really thirsty right now. Why can't she run back to old boy and ask for forgiveness? I am sure he loved her and still wants her despite her impatience! Godspeed back to the ex NOW!!

I have been you before with a good friend. I tried to tell her not to do it (marry old boy) but she did it. Then she and others smeared my reputation and said I was "hating" cuz I was single. I got over it and went dark on said friend for a few years. She came back before separating from him to tell me I was right the whole time. I had to tell her I didn't want to be right, I wanted her to be happy. Anyway, divorce ink is dry and we are all good.

Whereas before, I would try to tell people about the mistakes they were making because that is what I want someone to do for me, I have learned to keep my mouth shut and let grown folks be "pseudo" grown. I am not co-signing and I am not saying not to either. I am like Switzerland during WWII - neutral!

OneChele said...

She is really thirsty and unless you are in a position to quench it she isn't going to hear it. <~~ Nuff said.

sol_dier said...

Ding ding ding!.

Unlike a lot of the other commenters here.. I think your friend knows EXACTLY how wack her choice is, I think she simply feels there is nothing left else to do but this.
When she knows different. she'll do different.

OneChele said...

Totally stealing "boobookins"

taut_7 said...

i don't have anyone like this in my life. you're better than me. i don't get along with thirsty folks. also, i'm brutally honest with my friends and people that i care about. if i see someone on a self destructive path then i won't hold any punches. *shrug*

OneChele said...

I wish this fit on a T-shirt: Marriage is not the end-all/be-all that so many women think it is. Your life doesn't begin when a man asks you to be his wife. You are still wonderful & amazing even if you are single.

GrownAzzMan said...

Purple Rain Purple rain...oh I didn't see all of you there...LOL

OneChele said...

I have been on the receiving end of a "relationship reality check intervention" (Chele, walk away already!) and though I didn't want to hear it, I heard it. Then again, I'm sane (mostly) and recognize that when a group of people whose opinions your respect and trust tell you something - there's got to be some truth there.

OneChele said...

I know what you mean and it's a huge concern. We're going to keep an eye on the situation and be ready to step in when she lets us.

OneChele said...

I was telling someone on Twitter, the previous beau has disappeared like a superhero in a dark alley - POOF! and he was gone.

OneChele said...

I personally think the only void he's filling can be handled by something battery-operated but um... never mind.

SingLikeSassy said...

Here's what else is scary to me: She said all of you had called and nobody liked him. Nobody. Presumably all of you know and love Jackie and NONE OF YOU LIKED HIM. All of you are wrong because she "knows" him after a month?

Jackie if you are reading this, please see the flaming red flags all over the place here, pull your drawz up and get out now. Please.

OneChele said...

I'm so using Approval Suck in a post. Maybe a book too.

OneChele said...

Sometimes all you can do is throw holy water and run.

OneChele said...

Bouge personified. Live right so you can take fabu vacations - Amen.

OneChele said...

What with all the rebuking?

OneChele said...

She is doing the utmost.

OneChele said...

Welcome out of Lurkerville! Good luck on the LSAT!

David Chase said...

Imma need Jackie to step away from the dark side. There are plenty of "good men" looking for Jackies (without the neurosis) and she booed up with a zero. *kicks small trashcan*

OneChele said...

Run like Kunte-Kinte even on one good foot?

OneChele said...

Yeah the "I like him cuz he likes me" ideology never works out

OneChele said...

Not the Matlock marathon! Noooo! *step away from the Snuggie*

OneChele said...

No Drama Guy is gone like Keyser Söze. (If you've never seen The Usual Suspects, apologies but what are you doing with your life?!)

thinklikeRiley said...

Jackie book smart, cocoa stupid. Bad for her, good for dudes. Can I get a hook-up?

thinklikeRiley said...

Chick used Kayer Soze as a reference. <--instant wood.

thinklikeRiley said...

*fist bump*

OneChele said...

Made deaf, dumb and blind by thirst... explains a lot.

OneChele said...

That is my least favorite "female drama" issue EVER! When you tell a good friend the truth and she lashes out for it. Then you a villain for speaking true. Why I always say - if you don't want to hear the truth, don't ask me!

OneChele said...

She's got that whole "us against the world" mentality working right now.

OneChele said...

LOL just a small trashcan?

OneChele said...

Side-eye.

CaliGirlED said...

You know what they say, you can lead a horse to the water but you can't make it drink.

CaliGirlED said...

You're right there isn't anything ELSE Chele can say because Jackie's made her decision. And like the band on the Titanic, she's gonna play to the bitter end.

Hidi said...

SMH...If Jackie was my friend, I would ask, why? why? why?. I just don't understand. I would look at her as though she is crazy. You know what, when a person is in denial, it's like talking to a brick wall. All you can do is be there for her when she needs you. Trust me, she WILL need you.

William Martin said...

"The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was convincing the world he didn't exist." Keyser Soze

Brneyed1 said...

Again, speaking from experience (experience can be a B****):

If you know someone in this position, resist the urge to dog their SO. (hard, I know). Remember, she CHOSE dude, and an attack on him is a (perceived) direct attack on her. You are telling her that she does not have the capacity to make smart, rational decisions. And the smarter a person believes themselves to be, the harder it can be to accept the fact that they may have made a really bad decision.

And as mentioned in last week's Reality Check bougiepost entitled "Sometimes It Is Your Fault (sorry) ", some folks cannot (or will not) see their own contributions to their problems.

"Jackie" needs to feel whole. Attacking Scrabble Dude is the wrong approach. Gotta find that scared little girl inside her and give her a hug, and tell her she is fine just as she is. Until she believes it, no amount of side-eyeing and dirt-dishing on Dude is gonna help.

(therapy is also a B****, but soooo worth it)

CaliGirlED said...

Yeah unfortunately, she'll have to get burned to know that this fire is hot. And they may never see signs of abuse, short of her going to the hospital. He knows that she has a lot friends who care about her so more than likely he will make sure not to visibly bruise her. It might take a hospital visit before Chele and the crew know what's going on.

Cudos to you for admitting your past abusive relationship. I'm sure that's not always easy to share.

William Martin said...

The problem with women like Jackie is that they validate weak-assed dudes like HNM. They both need hugs and prayer and therapy.

MeetCharlieL said...

No. Good. Sense.

CaliGirlED said...

Agreed.

(Hey Chele, is there anything I can do about my "like" button not working?)

MeetCharlieL said...

Ooo. Wee.

CaliGirlED said...

This.right.here."...ready to step in when she lets us." And not a minute before! Because even if the guys of the crew, or whoever, get uber-un-bougie and whip up on HNM, she's going to lick his wounds and stay with him. So as has been stated, plus what you just said, all boils down to there's nothing you can do right now but be on stand by and ready to step in when she lets you. Oh and by ALL means pray! Prayer needs to always be at work, for those who believe, but it is useless until faith comes into play, and appropriate action is taken.

Brneyed1 said...

LOOOOVED The Usual Suspects!! "The greatest trick the Devil ever pulled was to convince the world he did not exist."

Ain't seen it?? Get it and watch it on Turkey Day while the itis sets in...

Penny said...

Got it, but I was just hopin"

MeetCharlieL said...

Sadly I know a "Jack" who has your girl beat hands down. He is putting up with all manner of shiggity (public/private humiliation, cocoa rations) just so he can "have somebody" - you remember that character in the movie Best Man Julian who had the shrew Shelby? Yeah like that. Damn shame. Not a good luck. Nobody can tell him ish. I'm done.

FreeBlackMan said...

This right here is the most flaming pile of ish ever: "He's at his best when you pump him up a little. " Any ninja who doesn't walk in the door thinking that he's the best ish to ever happened to you needs to turn the eff around.

Any chick who spends her time pumping up said limp d**k deserves what she gets.

OneChele said...

It's in my top 10 faves of all time.

OneChele said...

I know right!? If this was a plot I was writing, I would totally have the ex swoop in right now for the rescue and the ride off into the sunset. If ONLY I could script real life!

BlackButterfly said...

"if Jackie is your friend, what do you say?"

I have a Jackie in my life. We have been BFF's since we were 15 (we are over 35) and there is simply nothing that can be done when they refuse to acknowledge that there is a problem. As an accomplished physician my friend has created a life for herself that aesthetically looks wonderful but if you look deeper there are cracks in the foundation.

Low self-esteem is not something that most people recognize as something they need to resolve prior to entering into a relationship because they see the relationship (any relationship) as a remedy to the situation. Entering a relationship with ANY insecurity will attract emotional leeches that will have you settling for the shiggity (ie, cooing over 3 and 4 letter words). It also doesn't help that we live in a society that constantly tells women that you have an expiration date and if you don't have a man and/or marriage by some predetermined time frame then you are a failure. Change the thought process (that has been drilled into too many via fairy tale "ideals") and the the outcome will change and we can't do that for them.

My philosophy is prayer, love and honesty when asked for my opinion.

OneChele said...

Try using a different browser (this blog looks best in Chrome and Firefox)

OneChele said...

Julian was alright once he met "Candy" - brother got strong quick! Just takes a good woman?

CaliGirlED said...

Ah was runnin....

Steve said...

I'll send you a ticket. ;-)

Steve said...

I know a Jack as well - most whipped cuckolded dude ever. He keeps saying "You don't understand, this is what it means to be in a relationship!" Uh, getting my ass whipped mentally and being played a fool? No sir. No part of the game.

Grace said...

Well thanks, now the song is stuck in my head.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sn8KYD1Vco0

Grace said...

HATE THAT!

Grace said...

Alright now! Her remedy is a $19.99 plus batteries fix.

ASmith said...

What I say depends on what I'm asked.

However, my feelings are similar to yours, Chele. This is all bad everywhere. Maybe she's feeling like she missed the boat on the last guy and she's going to be sure she has her ticket and passport this time. Either way, I think my efforts moving forward would just be to remind her frequently that she's worth more than having to do all this extra to let a man know she's in to him.

I'd also remind her that I don't need to be convinced; sounds like she needs to be convinced.

GrownAzzMan said...

Props for the Best Man ref. Dude sounds like he is Doug Christie whipped...SMH

Andrea M said...

"He may have his flaws but he's here for me. He's really, really into me."
Isn't this line in the first act of half the movies on Lifetime?
Ladies, there is d! on every corner. Get some, use it and put it back.
Don't fall in love with every d! you dance on.
And d! that needs to win at Scrabble and know what you're talking about in casual conversation with your friend is d! you should have never (NEVER EVER) brought home.

Andrea M said...

LOVE LOVE LOVE that movie!

CorettaJG said...

Exactly. That's why I'm not mad at her for having you all give him the once over. There is a scripture that talks about in the counsel of the Godly there is safety. But, it is true that you can only do so much. You plant the seed, water it, but a person has to realize it for herself.

KAPSpecial said...

Okay, I just read the entry, but would like to get off topic for a minute (I haven't had a chance to read the other comments so maybe it's not that off). I think it's interesting that Jackie's previous dude was so awesome, Jackie was clearly ready for forever with Awesome Last Dude, and Awesome Last Dude was ready for forever with Jackie. So her ultimatum ruined it all? I call bullish. If Awesome Last Dude was ready for forever and was planning to propose later that year, how come he didn't tell her that? And what was so special about later that year? An engagment ultimatum is usually a woman saying, dude, I love you and know I want to spend the rest of my life with you and if you don't know how you want this to turn out by now, then let me know so I can move on with my life. I think ulimatums get a bad rap, because the dude who balks at it was (probably) never going to do right. So Jackie in that respect wasn't that thirsty and look where it got her. Perhaps her take-away from Awesome Last Dude is to get what you can get and make it work. Hopefully, she won't be slanging any ultimatums at HNM anytime soon. But perhaps he'll be the one that tries to wife her w/o a 3 yr trial period. Regardless, she had Awesome and it didn't make her happy. Maybe 3-letter word will do the trick.

Also I used to be quick to call someone (usually a woman) thirsty, desperate, etc. But time and my own dealings with the opposite sex have taught me to reserve my thoughts and most of all my judgments. I think you have a right to your opinion and she definitely solicited it so that's on her. But generally, every relationship is different and every person in a relationship is different. She has identified HNM's need for constant admiration and encouragement and she seems willing to meet that need. Should she be deemed thirsty for doing so? Personally, I'm not looking for a man who requires that kind of attention, but that's why I'm not dating HNM or anyone like him. That doesn't make me better than or less thirsty than Jackie.

P.S. I have a decent vocabulary. However, I suck at Scrabble. My Scrabble skills would make you question my literacy. That's why I rarely play and would never suggest it. I know HNM put up the front that he was going to do wonders, but maybe he was unaware of his Scrabblitis symptons that I also suffer from. (I realize you made other relevant observations about HNM, but I just wanted to throw that out there.)

P.S.S. First time posting and I wrote a novella.

Bunni said...

I had to come out of lurkdom for this. 26?!?!? Chile puhleeze!!

GrownAzzMan said...

*fist bump* on the Keyser Soze reference.

CorettaJG said...

It's hard for me to be too mad at her for looking for a ring after 3 years in a relationship. I just learned about another guy, an engineer friend, who lost his woman after "planning" to propose later and she left before they could get to later. Men are going to have to give the woman some clue that this is coming because 3 years and no indication of a ring is going to have me reconsidering my options as well. I'm just sayin'.

OneChele said...

Welcome. Without writing a book to match your novella (LOL), Awesome Last Dude had gone back to school in his early thirties to get an advanced degree. He was graduating later that year and had planned to wait until then. He had given indications to her that it was coming but she literally walked in one day with the "Now or Never" and things went rapidly downhill from there. I wasn't there only heard both sides of the story and it seems pride (on both sides) got in the way.

As for second point, I guess it depends on how we define thirsty. I think making a radical change in your personality (and this is a radical change) indicates a bit of parched-ass-ness (yeah, I made it up) to me but I see where you're coming from.

Lastly, I don't mind weak Scrabble skillz - it's not for everyone. I'm a thinker but I have no patience for Chess. However, this is why I don't smack talk Chess. "I'll take your bishop, son! Don't bring that weak castle move here!" Nope. Not gonna happen.

Anyway, post again. ;-)

OneChele said...

You know I had to look up how to spell it.

datdudeincali said...

"Parched-ass-ness"?!?
Cue the music:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uj-nDmXHmng

GrownAzzMan said...

Team Chrome here all day every day.

GrownAzzMan said...

I see you workin'

Just_A_Thought1218 said...

he he he, didn't mean to imply that. But, I suspect Jackie has the same issue that I have. No matter what environment I'm in, the Pookies and Ray Rays come a-flockin. I'm convinced that somebody implanted a IBM repellant on me and it'll keep what I"m looking for away until I find and remove it.

Well, actually, IBMs don't ignore me. They want to be my friend. Or they are so OOOOOLLLLLDDDD that I just am not interested. Or they are married and think (because I look younger than I am) that I don't know the signs of a married man. Boy bye!

Anywho, when you find that colony, leave a trail a breadcrumbs so that I may follow you there. K, Thx!

CorettaJG said...

Do it Bigandbeautiful2644! I'm a Louisiana native but spent a lot of time in Montgomery with my mom's family (and I'm a Tuskegee grad). The selection can be tough in Montgomery, I'm not going to lie, but there were eligible men from Alabama (the Gump in particular) at Tuskegee and they loved them an educated woman. I also met some potential matches at church. I've lived in Louisiana, Alabama, Tennessee, Texas and the DC area and I've met men with comparable education and intellect all along the way. They are definitely out there. Although, one of my sisters (an M.D.) met a police officer in Texas who doesn't have the comparable education but is bringing it in other areas.

My additional unsolicited advice on your LSAT (I'm an attorney) -- practice tests, practice tests, practice tests. Similar to studying for the bar. And it might be worth the investment of a Kaplan course or the like (perhaps as a graduation gift), to bring more discipline and test taking tips to your studying. I don't believe your LSAT score necessarily predicts how well you do in law school, but it definitely impacts your options for schools and scholarships. Just my two cents. Many blessings to you!

Just_A_Thought1218 said...

No, it's not easy, especially when I convinced myself that it wasn't as bad because I got out before it escalated to the "need makeup and thin excuses to cover this bullshiggity" stage. But, I think you have to do your part, at whatever level you are comfortable, to make sure that women know how to recognize the signs, and to not feel ashamed because it can happen to ANYBODY.

datdudeincali said...

I don't know, what do you think - is the only way to get over a bad relationship to have a good one?

datdudeincali said...

Hooking up with a person just because they smiled at you has got to be Trait #1 of classic thirstiness, no?

blackprofessor said...

Awesome movie! One of Spacey's best so far!

Just_A_Thought1218 said...

Props on the reference. And, if I may brag, I introduced the current beau to "The Usual Suspects." I think that was the moment he fell, lol.

Suebhoney1125 said...

I'd buy one!!

datdudeincali said...

Steve got a good dose of that "never give up"ness

Just_A_Thought1218 said...

Tabernacle.

CorettaJG said...

The Usual Suspects. Definitely one of the best movies ever made.

Bunni said...

You can even order some to be delivered in discreet brown paper wrapping.

Just_A_Thought1218 said...

"... parched-ass-ness" <~~~ You owe me a new keyboard!

And, knowing that bit of info, Jackie gets another side eye from me. I told a former beau that he had a year after he successfully defended his dissertation before we had the marriage talk (he was halfway through his PhD program, so he had 3 yrs or so before he had to make a decision). You don't walk BEFORE they're done with grad school. Let them get that degree (and job), give them a bit of time to exhale, and THEN start pulling in the reins.

baileyqc said...

LOL @ Dead and gone!

OneChele said...

Welcome out of Lurkerville!

CorettaJG said...

Some good points. I was saying something similar below about the 3 year relationship. C'mon with the waiting to get everything together and keeping these intentions to propose such a state secret men! You better let the woman know what the plan is or you're going to lose out. My engineer friend lost his woman that way and now has fallen headlong into a rebound relationship and now rebound woman wants her ring. His take on it. "Women nowadays are too pushy." Um...men nowadays need to be making some intentions very crystal, lucite, diamond clear when it's been 3 years.

baileyqc said...

I'm just going to need professional single women to repeat after me "I am not my marital status. I am no less a woman for not having a man. I love me some me." Lather. Rinse. Spin. and Repeat.

Woo-sah.

Man's World said...

Please understand that I am not "liking" your wood but the sentiment. #pause

Man's World said...

"If at first you don't succeed..."

MariSol said...

You betta preach.

MariSol said...

Can't hurt.

Iced_Coffee_Sweet_Tea_Diva said...

Hold your head up and walk out of the store with your purchase.

Leon X said...

This comment response made me drop my mug. (See what I did there?)

Sarah said...

I think being in a relationship can be like having the flu. Your judgment is impaired and your thoughts are cloudy. If somebody is adoring and affectionate, who doesn't want to think that it is because they really do actually adore and love you. And given both positive and negative signals, the first impulse with a lot of people is to hold onto the positive and excuse the negative. All of which is why it is a good idea to have the special someone meet your friends and family. Of course, there will be friends and family that have their own issues and may look on the person unfavorably because of them. But usually everybody has at least one person whose opinion they trust absolutely and that one you've got to listen to. In my case, it is my sister. She was very diplomatic about the last boyfriend, but then she didn't meet him because I lived 1/2 way across the country from her. But she did ask the "is it really worth it" question in response to some of my emails. I was already asking it myself so I didn't take offense.

Having said your piece, I don't think there is anything else you can do but keep the lines of communication open so that if she needs help, she feels like she can ask.

Rob said...

Let's see here. Scans comments - references Purple Rain, Usual Suspects, Best Man, Cameo, Forrest Gump, T.I., BoBs - Wow. What to add? I hope both of them find what they are looking for. Here's hoping they figure out it's probably not each other.

Iced_Coffee_Sweet_Tea_Diva said...

Meant to hit 'reply' instead of 'like'. Even at 36 it's not over, but we are programmed to believe in the almighty power of the biological clock ticking away in us. Enough with THAT particular ish!

Iced_Coffee_Sweet_Tea_Diva said...

*Uh-oh, got in trouble voice* Riley!!

OneChele said...

I see you sir...

All Honey said...

B*tches always got beef when you are trying to telling them a truth they don't wanna hear.

All Honey said...

You hit the nail on the head (no pun) right there. She had cocoa, she lost cocoa, she found good cocoa again. Don't confuse cocoa with love!

All Honey said...

Damn some breadcrumbs, can she GPS that ish? Send out coordinates?!

C Nelson said...

Yeah, this. Worse, badmouthing him is going to push her into protective mode where she feels she's the only one he's got / the only one who understands him, and if you think the insecure dumbing herself down is hard to shake, combine it with a Mission To Love Him and see what you get. :/

Carey Jackson said...

Oh Damn: Don't fall in love with every d! you dance on.

Carey Jackson said...

Oh Riley... SMH

Glendon said...

The first thing that caught my eye was the approval by proxy deal, that speaks to the fact that she knows this yard bird is a turkey, like Jessie she is keeping hope alive. What is really damning is the thumbs down by you, and posse et al, sure one person in the group may not like a person that is human nature, but all?

Your " she decided that old boy is the 3:10 " comment may be more true than you know. I don't know her, but I bet she is over 35 and that is when this "the- time- is- now-with-whoever" syndrome really kicks in hard. Could he be her prince in rusty armor, perhaps and the armor could be a rental.

As for the dude everyone liked and it did not work out after three years, being a man, old boy was NOT going to marry her, in any event. If he was, the day of the ultimatum he would have pre-wifed her up, ring or no ring, when a man is serious about getting married not much can stop him. This later in the year, crap was just that, crap.

I have a friend starring in this same show, which is in year three of syndication and due to a high drama quotient the ratings remain high( they break up , to make up real good) she is accomplished, beautiful and in other areas of her life damn near a genius, I told her my "truth" without chaser and I also told her when the mirror shatters I will help sweep up the debris, that is what a friend would do.

In the meantime, I watch, crack up and shake my head, at the end of the day, its her life.

Iced_Coffee_Sweet_Tea_Diva said...

Really praying for Jackie to open her eyes. Earlier today there was a tiny picture of a couple along with the title post that you wrote about finding love the second time around. Jackie may be fearful that she'll get to that stage of life (over 40, 50, 60) and not be married. Something tells me that she's not in the dark about her friends' concerns and that they may mirror some of her innermost concerns. Whatever the reason(s) that she has made her choice(s) ['cause she's not new to Relationshipville], I hope she recognizes the depths of your concerns. When she gets done with the 'Scrabble Idol' reject, be there; until then, watch with both eyes and pray. Jackie has to work on Jackie before she tries to find 'the one', and go there into the reasons that make her act/react like this. It's too bad about the love that got away but there's a message or signal in there, too. I despise and detest the "how to get and keep your man" messages that bombard males and females. Too many insecure hands turn the pages and absorb that junk like it's the gospel. It's not. The brain is the sexiest muscle in the body, self-confidence (not arrogance) is the definition of that muscle. Now, wish that there was a clip of a commercial from the 80's or 90's of an father talking to his daughter at college, in her first year away from home and feeling lonely, where he reminded her of a dance class exercise: take your right arm and reach and hold your left waist, take your left hand and touch your right shoulder, and then squeeze. Sometimes we have to give ourselves a hug because there's no one close by, and it's good.

brownstocking said...

really, with the female dog? That's universally understood, that people ask for advice they don't really want to hear. And they can be lost and confused without being "itches."

This is BougieLand, right?

Iced_Coffee_Sweet_Tea_Diva said...

No, not when you've got issues...

Iced_Coffee_Sweet_Tea_Diva said...

Yes, both websites begin with the letter 'B', but this is BougieLand, not Bossip. That. is. all.

Iced_Coffee_Sweet_Tea_Diva said...

*fist bump*

Iced_Coffee_Sweet_Tea_Diva said...

Effective is at that remedy can be, it won't fix what's wrong in her soul and in her head.

OneChele said...

May I say well done sir on this comment?

Three years in syndication and keeps getting renewed, huh? And yes, she is over 35 (as is the whole crew) so tickety-tock.

Oh and I'm stealing the "prince in rusty armor" phrase. Thanks!

brownstocking said...

late to the party, but I always bring Schramsberg Cremant, so...

I'm really interested in the real relationship, the former one, not this abusive (sorry, but my DV training kiced in as well) one. This is a horrible rebound, and folks need to not let her isolate. That's what he wants. I still think the previous sich has a 3 on it; they really need to talk and come to some sort of understanding. I think, after 3 years, mroe than pride could be at play.

Mm, and I have dumbed down when on a date with a man. [Full Disclosure: when I'm bored, I can stay doing the most with a little dramatic flair] But that's because he provoked me (big words comment) so I showed him exactly what he thought he wanted. "Oh, you're in grad school, with the smart folks, you don't need no man to take care of you, huh?!" So old. But, since I didn't really care, I decided to veg out for him, it was only dinner at Cicero's (for the STL folks).

No, no good came of it, it was fun at first (making big eyes, "could I have this, Big Daddy? Thank you!") and it was great for the post-mortem with my friends, but it couldn't be a lifestyle change for me.

But it really was FUN! He was so puffed up by the end of the night, when the end came (nother story) he was salty.

brownstocking said...

I so want to like the sentiment, but I can't agree with "gets what she deserves" in this particular instance, because I'm worried for her safety. But other than that, WERD.

brownstocking said...

I disagree that there is a drastic shortage of appropriate men. Maybe they don't look like the package you might want, but men are still at 49% of our population.

Also, you need to be STUDYING, not "checkin" for "nobody!" LOL

I kid, but keep first things first.

Jade Star said...

Ok, you've pulled me from lurking to post this.

I'm sorry, Jackie seems so thirsty the Gobi desert is looking at her like WTF. Seriously, someone needs to put some common sense in a sock and whack her with it. HNM is displaying wayyy too many red flags to NOT be noticed. I sense a lifetime movie in the making complete with restraining orders and all other kinds of nonsense. I hope she comes to whatever senses she has left before it gets dangerous!

brownstocking said...

see, this adds to the mystery, I'm not sure he was serious. Some folks get that advanced degree, and leave the current partner for a classmate or coworker...

Glendon said...

Why thank you, steal away….

My friend and her prince have broken up, gotten back to together, changed phone numbers on each other to the point of, making me break it down by season, this being year three. The episodes are spicy, but for some reason they will not leave each other alone and no she can't take him to a corporate function. He has a six pack and “other” talents. She has her masters and he is on probation, do I need to say any more?

The position of sexual power flips to men after age 35, what I mean by this is most attractive women could pick, chose and refuse who, what and when they have sex. Many women abused this power and grant the goodness to idiots, tease men, played games. So later on when the tables turn (and they do) picking be slim. Now a solid, employed, low drama man ( even with a potbelly) is now very desirable, because he may not be flashy, but he is stable.

As life goes on that little dweeb of a man, is either more established and or has his own company and can now date the hot 25 year old woman he could not get when he was 25, he can still have kids if he wants them and the field of possibilities is wide open for him, while the woman who is 35+ her choices dwindle daily (from what I hear they were not that great to begin with) regardless of her beauty, fine-ness, intellect, educational credentials, so on and so forth. Sure a woman can become “boo’ed” up, after 35, it happens all of the time, but is it significantly more challenging.
So that "thirsty" syndrome is running wild in that demographic of women ( sans color, education, etc) I see it frequently here in Atlanta. Many nerds are singing the “Mike Jones” anthem right now.

GrownAzzMan said...

This ---> "when a man is serious about getting married not much can stop him."

GrownAzzMan said...

*Drops a love offering in the basket in honor of all the single professional women he knows, adjusts tie and walks quietly through the doors*

GrownAzzMan said...

*DEAD* @ parched-ass-ness...LOL

The_A said...

'THEN start pulling in the reins'

I don't want to live til death do us part with someone I had to reign in.

It might be naive but I want him to reign himself in or step off. When we jump the broom, I'll know it is because he wants to be there not because I cajoled or manipulated him. Lead me! N'amsayin?

I hope Jackie swallows that pride & goes to talk to Awesome.

He should not swoop in to save her. Let her put on her big girl pants, apologize, and lay her heart out there for him in a grand gesture. It couldn't be any more vulnerable or painful than the incessant choking as she swallows her brain piece by piece for Scrabble Jr. And the reward far outweighs the risk from what I've read about Awesome Last Dude.

If he says no, she grows from it and moves on. But the BIGness will remind her of how fearless she can be and instantly cure her of allowing losers to hang around her aura.

Iced_Coffee_Sweet_Tea_Diva said...

If this right here does not cover it all, only a thimbleful is left...

GammasWorld said...

Bless her heart and in the most serious tone possible with a hug.

OneChele said...

Ha! Welcome out of LurkerLand.

OneChele said...

Not "could I have this, Big Daddy?
LMAO!

OneChele said...

Potbelly I could work with, probation? Uh... not unless it's for traffic violations. ;-)

CaliGirlED said...

Thanks Chele, Firefox it is!

CaliGirlED said...

Good cocoa will have you thinking you're in love! Woo chile!!!...One must always be able to walk away from good cocoa!

CaliGirlED said...

Matlock marathon??? Damn diamond, you ain't playin!

CaliGirlED said...

Hold up, playback time! Don't yall get it??? She doesn't just like him because he's really into her. She likes him because:
"He's really smart and fun."; "He's just a strong personality."; "He's at his best when you pump him up a little." (she's seen him in best light); "He may have his flaws but he's here for me."; and last but not least, you guys just couldn't "get to their level".

Jackie has made (in her mind) a strong case for this man. He is great in her world. Note: her mind, her world. Only Jackie can change this. Perception is reality and right now her reality is warped.

CaliGirlED said...

One of my very good friends was asking my opinion about her situation. I asked, "Do you want the truth or do you want the truth?" She knew what I meant. Had to tell her about her faults before I could get to his! She received it.

CaliGirlED said...

One month. Hell they haven't even had a good argument yet. (Very few people are so lucky). But you need time to at least see how a person acts when they're upset or frustrated with you. Do they deal with it respectfully, walk away for a little "time out", attempt to talk it out, or go upside your damn head? Not that you need approval, but how are they with your friends and vice versa, your family, their family. One month, yall still holding in farts!

YardieChicie said...

Dude? My exact words as I read that were, "What is this? 'Sweet Valley High'?"

YardieChicie said...

Oh boy! She started feeling over the hill at 26, while I'm 27 and my clock isn't even wound up to tick. Wow, that is sad.

CaliGirlED said...

"Uh uh Jackie don't do that....and what I do go and put him down when he trying..." As she wiped the blood from her mouth. (What's Love Got To Do With It-couldn't remember the whole line)...Classic example of what you two ladies said.

YardieChicie said...

Aiyiyi! >_< Luckily, I only have 2 'best' friends - one's engaged to a great guy after 3 years of dating, and one's sworn to celibacy so I doubt I'll be dealing with any of such ish in my future. At least I hope not.

However, I'd do what you did - air my misgivings about the relationships. If she refuses to see reason and thinks I'm out to ruin her life or something, then I'd have to leave her to see for herself. Some people learn better with practical rather than oral instruction.

CaliGirlED said...

Chele you say Jackie is smart and I'm not saying that she's not, but 1) She walks out on potential fiance when he was just about to get his advanced degree and 2) She cheers "Hercules Hercules" when current S.O. spells "coat"...Maybe she's mentally exhausted. I think that's possible.

CaliGirlED said...

"prince in rusty armor" *dead*

Glendon said...

You my dear lady have standards, that is not true across the board. Ivan the inmate has them lined up! In my old business, I had access to prison letters, man the stuff I have seen! There are a lot of women, waiting on Calvin the convict to home, I am serious.

Ms. Jay said...

I heard somewhere single is not dead.

Yofabulous said...

*Sticking my toe in the comment pool for the first time*

I lived this scenario with a good friend a few years ago. All I could do was continue to be a friend and gently point out red flags as the relationship progressed. When he turned into her personal stalkerazzi she finally had her "enough" moment. Took the whole village to run him off...

OneChele said...

Welcome! And wow - the whole village coupled with "stalkerazzi" paints quite a vivid picture!

Stank_0 said...

I have to disagree, but I'm supremely stubborn. If I'm plannin to marr' (marry for those not in tune with Texoma slang) you and the ultimatum comes down, it's not gonna be a good outcome.

At that point, nothing short of a ring on the scene is gonna kill the argument.

Brittanygeneva said...

Thanks for you last graph because there really are SO many thirsty guys out here and I've encountered so many of them lately. Not the same type of "put a ring on it" thirsty, but definitely a "drooling over a girl who clearly doesn't want you" thirsty, and it's really really ugly and annoying. Worse than thirsty women.

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