Apologies and apologies again to all who have emailed in. OneChele has been swamped and working like both Kunta and Kinte. I was able to reply to a few of you personally and I hope I had something semi-intelligent to say. For those not in the know, every few weeks I take the opportunity to address a few questions from my angry adoring readership in a segment we call Ask a Bougie Chick. So without further ado, here is this month's installment. (As always names changed to protect the innocent/guilty and the only edits made were grammar and spelling corrections)
First up is Sassy from Shreveport, LA with a semantics issue:
Hi OneChele,
What is the difference between being a b*tch and acting b*tchy? I ask because my husband says I have been displaying "real b*tch tendencies" lately. Yes, I know that's unacceptable from him and have made it clear that I won't put up with it. But when I called him on it, he says he wasn't calling me a b*tch per se. We even went so far as to argue noun vs. adverb use. To explain our situation, I'll give you a little background. I was raised what you would call bougie, he was raised (according to your sliding scale) kinda ghetto fab. So he says I'm overly sensitive to the word since I didn't grow up with it being used in my house. Furthermore, I'll grant you I was being a little cranky the first time he called me b*tchy. But I don't think I'm wrong to ask that the word be banned in my house, especially when directed to me. I'm correct on this, right?
I pretty much know the answer, I just wanted to vent.
Thanks, Sassy
Dear Sassy,
The hell you say?! Girlie, I don't care if you were wearing a T-shirt with "Call Me a B*tch" on it in large lettering while waving your middle fingers in the air… there is NO call for your husband (not a boyfriend or fling) to be calling you any sorts of b*tches. It matters not whether he tacks on the "-y" or softens it with "tendencies". What if you started telling him that he was acting like d*ck, displaying d*ck tendencies? Isn't that the same as calling him a d*ck... per se? Pretty much.
Now if we are going to slice up semantics and word usage, sure – there is a difference between walking around in full b*tch mode all day every day and being a little cranky/hormonal from time to time. However, neither of these scenarios allow for the man you took vows with to call you all sorts of female canine equivalents. Might I suggest that you remain firm and unflappable in your demand for that word to not be directed at you in any shape or form? Girl I don't care if he was raised behind a whorehouse in the Boogie Down Bronx with a pimp named Reefus as a father and a crack ho named Strawberry Wine as a mother… he is now married to you and needs to act accordingly.
Sassy, I could go in all day and night on this one. Get him told, girl. I'm going to file this under "I WISH A MF WOULD" and leave it at that. Thanks for visiting the Black n Bougie, come again soon.
Sincerely,
OneChele
And from Dee in Los Angeles, CA with a classic dilemma:
Hello OneChele,
Your blog is great for giving me "reality check" moments especially in my relationship. I've been with my S.O. for five and a half years. In your terms, I'm starting to give him the stern side-eye because I want to know – where's my ring?! As a joke, I changed his ringtone to play Single Ladies whenever I call. He took that about as well you think he did. He says the fact that he's there shows how much he cares. We've been living together for the past two years and now he is talking about wanting kids. I say not without a ring. I am in my mid-thirties and I don't want to wait anymore to have that perfect family. I know this is an age old question but this time it's me asking and hoping you can tell me something. I mean do I walk out on almost six years to force his hand? Do those ultimatums ever work? Am I just being an idiot?
Appreciate what you do!
Dee
Dear Dee,
Thanks. I strongly you suspect you know the answer to your dilemma and just need to bounce it off someone. Sure, I can be that person. You know the old saying about the cow and the milk? Yeah, that one's true. You have been giving away the entire dairy department free of charge for YEARS. You waited a LONG time to give the side-eye. Did you indicate at all during the first five years of the relationship that marriage was something you expected? Did you discuss what the future looked like before you moved in together? Not beating you down, just checking to see where the escalation is coming from now.
That being said, let's address a few other things. What kind of man asks you to have his kids without asking you to marry him first? That's SO not bougie. I'm concerned when I hear you mention your age. Are you feeling pressed because your biological clock is ticking or because you really think it's time? When you say you are ready for your "perfect family" do you think getting a ring from him will automatically generate perfection? I just worry that you haven't been realistic in your expectations.
Ultimatums have been known to work but I don't know your man. If he was peevish over a ringtone, I doubt you packing up and saying "Ring or Nothing" will go over any better. You need to do a few things. One, decide if you want to be with this guy for him or because he's there and you're ready for your picket fence close-up. Then you need to talk to him about what sort of future/ timeline he has in his mind. And finally, you have to decide if you can accept the ramifications that an ultimatum will bring. Whatever you decide to do, do what's best for you. Thanks for visiting Black n Bougie - come back soon!
I wish you all the best,
OneChele
Well, I think I was reservedly succinct (sort of). I could have written pages to both them, bless their hearts. Alright BougieLand, whatcha think? Got any words of wisdom for Sassy and Dee? Any similar experiences to share?
42 comments:
And by the way, this is the smartest comment on here.
I don't think anyone was making this a man wrong girl right case. I think generally everyone thought that these were issues that should have been discussed before either relationship went this far.
Dee moved in with a man and didn't have a ring on.....#FAIL You can't give stuff away for free and then try to charge for it. Dude is living like he is already married. Sex, Meals, more Sex. And guess what? If he cheats on you it's not adultry because he is just your roommate. He's living fat and happy.
Hmmm....
I skip the b**** letter b/c there's alot more goin on than we were told.
To the other: ultimatums do NOT work unless you are ready to go through with it. If it is a ploy, you will lose.
This is what men get upset about. Ya'll were perfectly aight to "kick it" now you switched it up. If you wanted marriage you needed to make that crystal clear, so-easy-a-caveman-could-do-it, connect-the-dots, color-by-the-numbers easy to understand.
Also, if you are the only one that has ever talked about marriage, then obviously he's not thinkin about marriage.
All I can say perched here at the age of 45 (where did the time go?) is that life is just too darn short. You don't get any of the time back. There are no do-overs. If you are with somebody who is not as enthusiastic about being with you as you are being with them, then celebrate YOUR life and pack it up and move on. Hopefully, if you want to, you will find somebody who wants to live their life with you and if not, then you can go out and do all the things you wanted to do, but didn't before it is too late.
Oh Ladies... Just. Say. No. No to being any kind of bitch in your own home and no to settling for being a baby's mama when you want to be a wife. Just NO!
Both of these guys are getting over. Ghetto dude married up and acting like he married Shawquanda, as Stank says below - there's something else going on there. Live-in dude got what he wanted and he knows she isn't going anywhere... she knows it too
OneChele - I agree! Both of these women already know the answers, they are just looking for a co-signer. Almost six years and no ring? Walk away. Sassy's situation is so see through to me. He's calling you a bitch today what will he call you tomorrow? Get out now.
To Sassy: No.No.No. Being called out your name by the man whose name you carry is oh.so.wrong. You are his Queen not a four legged creature. I don't care if you were spitting fire out your mouth and tearing the house to pieces he has no right to call you an animal.
To Dee: I advise my little sisters on this all the time, because I live in Baltimore, Maryland which seems to be 'BabyMama, BabyDaddy' capital of the world. Girls think its cute when a boy says, "Oh girl, I want you to have my baby". Excuse me but, "WHAT. THE. HELL.???" What happened to, " Baby I love you so much, I want you to have my last name?" I personally think there should be a year of dating; get to know each other, then year two talks of the future should be very frequent and wedding bells should begin to chime for both people, by year three we should be walking down the aisle (and this even a long time span to me, but marriage shouldn't be taken lightly, neither should it take forever to figure out if you want to spend forever with someone). Common said it best, "It doesn't take a whole day to recognize sunshine". You know in your heart of hearts that it is time to pack it up, cry it out, and wait for someone who will marry you in a heartbeat, because if brother hasn't asked you in 5 1/2 years I don't think he ever intends to. When a man loves a woman, has found his Queen, he snatches her up quick and begins to build his kingdom; find Queen, build castle, raise princes and princesses, run kingdom.
Dee, this is called involvement without the commitment. There is a difference between being committed and contributing in relationships:
When someone contributes they are giving only part of who they are.
When someone commits, they are giving all of who they are (....including his last name)
I wish we had more of Sassy's story - it's seems easy to sit here on the outside of their marriage and say demand better or walk away. This is her marriage we are talking about. No, it's not okay to be treated that way but there should be some steps between he's treating me bad and I'm calling a lawyer.
Dee on the other hand is not married to that selfish pr*ck. Get out now before he sucks you under.
Woo - were are the girls like this when I'm on the hunt? Ladies, ya making it too easy. You gotta demand up front what you want from a man, if he can't give it to you, he'll walk away. If he don't give it to you, you walk away.
Sassy's story takes me back to my married days - not fond memories. We were also from divergent backgrounds. And he started out okay just a few issues here and there. Then the loud talking and verbal squabbles started, it escalated from there. Sometimes background differences are not economic but value-based and cultural. If you were raised to talk to people any old kinda way, eventually, that comes out. I would bet Sassy married hastily (as I did) and didn't realize the extent of their difference outlooks even in basics like communication and partnership.
WAIT! Did you say Sassy's husband's parents were Reefus and Strawberry Wine? Oh my God, you are CRAZY! This is only my second day on the blog and I am dying!
Sassy needs a counselor, Dee needs a moving company.
Natural, I LOVE THIS!
CHUCH! When I'm dealing with a woman I know out the gate, this is a marriage material or someone to fill the time until marriage material comes along. Never would I make a time-filler into Mrs. Perry. She made herself a time filler.
Riley, I'm so stunned you said something I can actually agree with. Someone mark the date
For Sassy: I'm always skeptical of people when they call me something and then say "I didn't call you that, I said you were acting that way..." If I was "acting" happy, and you said "Hey, you're happy today" you'd be calling me happy based on actions you've seen. So side-eye to your husband for not just apologizing on the spot.
For Dee: Co-sign OneChele completely, especially the cow and milk reference. It's not too late to tell him what you want and that you expect him to get with the program, BUT... be prepared for whatever consequences there are, including him throwing the deuces and leaving. His perogative -- but why do you have to be unhappy so he can be comfortable... or whatever? Like OneChele, I surely do not understand men who refuse to marry their girlfriends but are more than happy to have kids with her. What the hell is that? Truth be told, it kinda pisses me off.
Anyway, if his decision is to be out try to bear in mind that it frees you to find the man who DOES want to marry you. And I know all this is far easier said than done, but still... he's being ridiculous and you oughta treat yourself better by expecting him to have the decency to marry the woman he wants to mother his children. :)
Well no reason for men to get upset. Sometime the game changes. True, Dee wasn't smart to go all in thinking he was on the same page with her but if she decided she wants marriage, women are allowed to change their minds. If wants to change with her great, if not... onto the next
I hate to be mean but women like this just make me grind my teeth! Women please, know yourself and what you want before presenting yourself to a man.
"If it is a ploy, you will lose."
I agree. Don't ever give someone a "It's my way or the highway" demand and not be ready for them to walk; which was also my point in my response. He might leave -- but if marriage is what she truly wants, then she should be ready for that if it's not what he wants.
If she's willing to compromise, then an ultimatum is unnecessary but she presents it like she's no longer willing to compromise. That or she wants someone to give her a magic potion that will make him wake up and choose marriage on his own, which ain't happening or else it already would've.
I'm not saying walk, I'm saying talk it out and demand respect. Marriage is work, but if both people are willing to work at it then you are on a long road to happiness. If only one person is willing to put in the work then you can do bad all by yourself.
I agree, I have three older brothers, one little brother, was raised by my Dad and I have a slew of Uncles, male cousins and homeboys so needless to say I know my way around the male mind. Men will do what you let them, but when they see something they want nothing can stop them from pursuing it, attacking it and keeping it. Men don't play games, they put it upfront, so say what you want from the get go and go from there.
Yes ma'am - the thing about an ultimatum is that you have to be willing to stand your ground. If you are willing to walk, don't say "either marry me or I walk" - that's just a stupid test no one passes.
If she finds that magic potion, she needs to bottle it and sell it on the Secret Sister Underground Railroad - she'll make millions.
Interesting. So the same way a woman knows within the first five minutes whether she's sleeping with you that night or not, you know whether she's marriage material? For real though?
I was about to call bullshiggity on Jason but you did it classier.
Thank you Riley!
BTW, I like this other side of you. ;)
Well just like you can tell a "HELL NO" from jump, so can we. Same way you can tell a maybe, as can we. So okay, maybe we don't know a definite marriage candidate in five minutes but pretty early on we can tell if she's not making the cut.
Eye Candy, I beg to differ. She knew from jump she was marriage minded, but he didn't.
Jason P is correct but we don't know that quickly. Once we do know there's a choice, cut her loose or keep her while we wait for future Mrs. to switch, sashay, etc into our lives.
I personally come up front from date two. "I'm not looking for anything serious" If a woman stays around after that, either she's not looking for anything serious or she thinks she can change my mind... which is NOT my fault.
As for Sassy, that's some ridiculousness on a whole other level. Any man who can call his wife that repeatedly and be okay with it... doesn't bode well for the future. IMHO
I think both couples need some outside interference if they are going to survive. It's obvious that both of these women are not standing up for themselves or they wouldn't be writing in to convince themselves that they are right.
Men will take what you give and run right down the field with it so like others have said in the comments, it's the woman's job to set the rules, boundaries and standards early. And hold the man to them. It's not an ultimatum if everyone already knows the guidelines. Think of it as a school system. You get to stay in school and go to the next level if you pass all your classes. You are being taught the curriculum, you just have to study, perform and pass. If you can't you get left behind. Simple.
Jayme is our resident relationship expert. Not only has she been married for 16 years, she is a life coach and relationship counselor. I no longer date without her input - LOL!
That makes sense
Ha! Riley, you keep making sense we won't know what to do ;-)
First time on the blog, what an interesting discussion. I think pretty early on both parties need to have the expectation setting discussion. Heaven forbid you actually have to tell a man you expect not to be called a bitch. But in Dee's case, they should have had this discussion years ago. The word baby should not be falling out of his mouth before the words "marry me"
We can agree to disagree since we don't really know what either of them thought going in, we just know where they are now. I still say you can go into a relationship thinking it's one thing and change your mind to make it something else along the way.
Oh not crazy, just a little to the left of off. ;-)
So are you saying the men are wrong in these cases? I say the boys are just being boys.
Welcome and cosign!
LOL - why we gotta sashay?!
Are you really coming with the "boys will be boys" argument? FAIL! yes the woman should set the rules but men should know how to act after a certain point. let's not act like the men have no culpability here
Thank you for some common sense!
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