After yesterday's innocently intentioned post which set off a comment firestorm, I'm a little wary about powering forward with Double Standard Week. However, I have nothing else prepared so we're foraging onward.
I grew up with a South American father who would outfitted my sister and I with chastity belts if he could have. BougieMom handed us the Sex-Ed pamphlet with the following lines triple underlined in red: The best form of birth control is ABSTINENCE. Yes, we got the message. There would be no skankitude in the Bougie Household. As if this wasn't enough, BougieDad made it sound like premarital sex led directly to a life of dunking sliced potatoes and flipping sizzling beef at the local Dairy Queen. Suffice it to say, we were not the ones hooking up under the bleachers at the pep rally.
A few months ago, I was talking to some a male friend of mine from high school. He was a renowned dog back in the day, now supposedly reformed and married with kids.
He said, "Remember when ya'll had the pact that you wouldn't sleep with over x number of guys?"
I nodded.
He laughed, "How'd that work out?"
I raised a brow, "I'm still within the number."
His jaw dropped, "What?! All these guys you've dated?"
"Yeah son, unlike you I don't confuse a date with naked Twister. One doesn't necessarily lead to the other."
"Wow, you're holding down that good girl thing, aren't you?"
"Would you rather I turned skanky? Cuz I think it's a little late for that."
"Well what number is skanky?" he asked.
"I don't know, I think when you get to the point that you can't remember names or faces – that's too many."
"For men or for women?"
"Either, why?"
"Well, I know a lot of guys who can't remember names and never saw the faces. Hell sometimes, I didn't even ask for names."
"Now that's sliding toward slutty, dude. I mean damn, pause for a name, huh?" I teased.
"Shut up, I was a young buck out there doing what I could do."
"No doubt. So what number do you think is too high?"
"It depends on the age of the female but I don't think it should be more than 10 a decade. I think for men, you can multiply that by ten."
"Boy, you are tripping. So when a woman is in her 30s, you think it's okay if she's slept with 30 men but her partner of the same age would have a number between 300 and 400? Where did this formula come from?"
"The inner workings of my mind. But my number isn't THAT high - I left myself room to grow." He smiled.
I shuddered, "Eeew, that's scary and a blatant double standard."
"Don't hate me cuz it's a playa's world."
"Boy, bye."
Okay BougieLand. Play nice. Why is it more acceptable for a man to run up his number and not a female? Why do people even want to know what the number is, does it make a difference? With the exception of a Chamberlain-like number, is there a number beyond which you just don't want to be next? And can there ever be a number that's too low?
48 comments:
Oh - you went there, huh? IMHO, never ask a question you don't want to know the answer to. I asked an ex- what age he was when he first had sex, he said 9. NINE! So I knew better than to ask the magic number question.
WHAT is that formula your boy came up with? I have never heard of such a thing. Yeah, I don't ask or answer this one.
There are very few good ways that this conversation can end well unless you are Amish children entering society for the first time. I recall sitting in stupefied horror while this guy I was seeing wrote his list. For some STUPID reason, we decided to exchange lists. Mine was on a post-it note. Let me just say he ended up putting it on a spreadsheet! And some of the names were "Girl from Step Show", "Woman in blue dress" - TMI, TMI!
I think I may have commented on topics like this enough. Maybe I will observe. Men can't handle that they aren't really the dominant sex. They have long been creating ways for us to stay back in the cut and let them run this world. Sex was just one way they oppressed us. This will continue until we women take a higher stand against men and their wack sexual double standards. Sure men and women have different ways about them, but not as much as we think.
Thats another topic all together. How old was the girl? I have a friend who had his first sexual encounter w a 16 year old when he was 8. I told him he was molested, he says he doesn't see it that way. WHATEVER.
What good ever comes out of sharing this information? As long as the number stays where it is while the two of you are together, I don't see any reason to discuss.
The best way to have the numbers conversation is to not have it.
Men come up with the number by using the same math that Wall Street uses to come up with derivatives. I saw the equation on a chalk board in college.
Ummmm yeah, why is that conversation needed?? The only one we are going to have is "what time did we say we were going to the clinic?" I wanna see test results!
I really don't mean to stir stuff up but I always ask. If she won't tell me, I wonder if it's because she has something to hide.
So her number would affect the relationship, do you think your number should affect the way she feels about you?
I don't think the guy's number is as important
Ya kinda walked right into that one... thanks for proving my point. ;-) This is the definition of a double standard
LMAO at the derivative equations!
Excellent Point!
Like you say Chele, I want test results, DNA samples, credit report and references LOL! I don't need to know that number.
Just say NO! to this discussion. And to further the double standard, no one would blink if a 30 year old woman said her number was 1 or 2 but if a 30 year old man said the same?
True story: I recently asked this question and the guy pulled out his iPhone - he had custom created an App to track this. Then he asked if I wanted him to leave the next slot open for me... FAIL
Ducking cuz I know the blows are coming but let's be realistic here, no guy wants to marry a woman who has been around the block so many times that it is named after her. And while sure, men should be held to that same standard... they aren't. No woman is going to double-think marrying a rich, successful, handsome guy just because he's got a track record. So maybe the best thing is just not to ask the question at all.
I would double think it. I think if a guy is that big of a dog before me, how will his behavior change with me? Not sure the rich, successful part is worth that kind of a gamble. Might be a different topic: Once a dog, always a dog?
LOL at the Amish children
@Man's World - I don't think you can assume that just because she won't answer the question that her number is high. She may think it's none of your business
I'll admit to an active past but I don't think that should impact who I am and who I'm with today. To answer Kiki's questions, dogs can reform and so can "active" women. There generally comes a point when people get tired and shut it down.
And yet I know so many women "of block fame" who are married. You think all of them hid their past?
I'm gonna surprise ya'll - I don't care what a chick's number is. As long as when she's with me, she's with me. If she wants to keep practicing those skillz she picked up on me - I ain't mad about it.
Oh Riley, so close. SMH
Like True and Queen said below, I'd be more concerned about the age when they began having relations then the number of people in between. Sometimes it's better just not to know things.
Insert your "There's an app for that" joke HERE.
* DEAD * with the App for that.
I won't bore ya'll with the whole psychology of sexual dynamics. There's a whole study about sexual activities and stages of life. So I would be more concerned with a man/woman in their mid-thirties, early 40's still "dogging/catting around" like a 20-year old. There's a reason why they call things "youthful indiscretions" and a reason why they say "with age comes wisdom". Wish it worked that way. Co-sign with whoever said Don't ask the question if you aren't prepared to hear the answer.
Im not marrying a guy who cares more about what went on between my legs than about what kinda person I am to him and how I treat him. I dont want to marry and insecure man. Sorry.
Umm Yes - I have a don't ask, don't tell policy on this one.
All of this falls under the heading of "I don't wanna know!" Learned this lesson the hard way, me and this girl exchanged lists and she went all CSI on me trying to find out who and where these girls were. Two months of her staring down every girl named Lisa in a 20 mile radius. On my part, she had a name on her list that I recognized. Hated that guy and didn't want anything he'd ever touched. It was a bad move all the way around. As a matter of fact, the relationship was fine until we did this.
People keeping using the word "Active" like it's a sports term. A person that bikes, swims, runs and plays tennis is active. There is a difference between having relations with people who you are with and sleeping with anything that moves. Don't ask questions you don't want answers to.
Lemme see how to put this, if the store is mine now, I wanna know how many customers have been served.
@man's world - not sure where to start. With the fact that you keep re-proving OneChele's point for her or the fact that your inner chauvinist is showing. between you comments yesterday and today, Imma send up a prayer for you boo... assuming you have one.
Ojo- You ain't said nothing but a word.
Sadly the double standard will continue to exist. I remember my mom saying that a boy could run the streets and put on a suit later and everyone would say how handsome he was. If a girl ran the streets and later put on a dress the only thing people would remember is her not being a lady earlier. Doesn't make it right, just stating the situation. However, I don't think you're doing yourself any favors by avoiding this conversation. If you are adult to lie down with someone, be adult enough to have an honest conversation. Frankly I don't think you should stop there, get test results and PROTECT YOURSELF-your life depends on it. I don't think there is a set number, it's going to vary from person to person. If you don't like the answer, keep your panties/boxer briefs on.
Kiki-my husband told me a long time ago that every man has dog in him. Basically the determining factor is how tight he keeps his leash. I would render a guess that the same can be said for women too. Self control is a very important human quality.
I always have this discussion. I have nothing to hide and I need to know what I'm working with. Are we talking legal pad, lined, one-sided or spiral notebooks front and back? I like to know what all level of nonsense is coming with me. And yes, I need the protection and disease discussion as well.
At some point you have to decide that you are going to accept some as they are, history and all, drama and all. If a number is going to change that, that can't be called love but some other relationship.
For a man to be considered two low that would mean I've had to have more partners than him. I just don't see that happening. So ...
I think there is no number that's too high. As long as you have a clean bill of health and you're still not trying to stick everything in town then we're cool. I'd consider dating you. Keyword is consider.
I'm late to the party today, I actually had to earn my paycheck. This discussion is always dicey but I try to introduce some variant of the how ya been livin' discussion. maybe I'm naive but I think you get a sense of how many laps people have done around that block.
LOL Sasha, we just pray for Riley.
Her staring down every girl named Lisa is hilarious. Yes Skyy, lesson learned. NO LISTS! If you feel compelled to share numbers okay but names and whatnot= no bueno!
Lady - get your preach on girl.
This blog is NEVER dull. I'm still trying to wrap my mind around the math your boy came with. Everybody should just get a T-shirt that says, "I am not my number." and move on.
There is a clear double standard. Men are expected to "play the field." Women are expected to be nuns. This is confirmed in the psychological literature. Men are attracted to women who were attractive to all men but who exclusively want them. This is been proven over and over again.
From my standpoint, who wants a beautiful woman who doesn't know what to do? How does a woman get experience without... getting experience. Catch-22.
Over the last 15 to 20 years, we have seen a "revolution" in women's attitudes. Many women are acting like men with regard to sex. There's a whole episode devoted to this in the HBO television series Sex and the City. As a matter of fact, Samantha acted like a man with regard to sex. Is this good or bad for American society? I don't know. I can tell you this, I found my wife and I'm happy.
No one wants to ever talk about the other side of this "double standard". The side that says that a guy who hasn't had many partners or much sex past a certain age is totally clowned (the 40 year old virgin), whereas a woman who's had a really low number is considered virtuous. Somone may bring up Susan Boyle as a counter-argumnet for what I just said and I'd contend that was based on her appearance, not the fact of virginity.
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